Was that in response to me? I don't understand your point. I've had a bit too much sun today 
Doctor Who... Page 1,008
I think that would be yes and no my learned colleague. What point did you not understand?
Quote: Jennie @ July 8 2013, 8:43 PM BSTAn interesting article.
Generally, I find the problem with the depiction of women in all forms of literature is not about the woman herself - it is that all her interactions are focused on or about men.
It fails the Bechdel test - have two named female characters, talk to each other, about something other than men.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bechdel_test
The woman then becomes defined by the stronger male character (such as the Doctor) with whom she spends nearly all her time.
What fails the bechdel test? Pride and prejudice?
As for Dr who, turn left, most of the Katherine Tate stories, smith and Jones, blink etc etc loads of stories where the Dr is a tangential character
If you look for offence you will find it
Quote: Marc P @ July 8 2013, 9:07 PM BSTI am no mathematician
[quote name="sootyj" post="995796" date="July 8 2013, 9:19 PM BST"]What fails the bechdel test? Pride and prejudice?
As for Dr who, turn left, most of the Katherine Tate stories, smith and Jones, blink etc etc loads of stories where the Dr is a tangential character (and lead female characters don't just talk about him)
If you look for offence you will find it
Besides in Brigette Jones how much do any of the lead male characters discuss anyone other than the female lead.
It just means you watch shows that relate to your interest.
Gah its like Wonder Woman never happened.
Quote: Marc P @ July 8 2013, 9:07 PM BSTPersonally I don't give a shit about the depiction of men in literature.
That's OK, I never asked you to. But I do care about the depiction of women in literature/art/film. It's less about the personality traits depicted and more about the role ascribed to the female character.
Art reflects society. The fact that so much art fails this very simple test suggests that women are still perceived to have a supporting role in our society.
Quote: chipolata @ July 8 2013, 9:23 PM BST
Like I said to Carol Vorderman.... 'You do the maths!'
Quote: sootyj @ July 8 2013, 9:26 PM BSTBesides in Brigette Jones how much do any of the lead male characters discuss anyone other than the female lead.
Sure. But can you name many more?
Quote: sootyj @ July 8 2013, 9:19 PM BSTWhat fails the bechdel test? Pride and prejudice?
Nope. P&P passes. They talk about balls and the awful mother and the fact Lydia is a filthy whore. The female characters can talk about ANYTHING other than men. Even if it's just once.
Quote: Jennie @ July 8 2013, 9:30 PM BSTThey talk about balls
Teehee.
Quote: Marc P @ July 8 2013, 9:07 PM BSTPersonally I don't give a shit about the depiction of men in literature. That could be a different issue but we are about fifty years on since 1960's - I am no mathematician - and I have only ever worked with one editor in TV and fiction publishing that was male.
The Bechdel test was invented in the 1980s.
I bow to your superior knowledge on the number of female TV execs etc.
I'm still a little confused as to where your mathematics abilities come into it 
Quote: zooo @ July 8 2013, 9:32 PM BSTTeehee.
Quote: zooo @ July 8 2013, 9:28 PM BSTSure. But can you name many more?
Sex and the City, I don't how she does it.
Or shall I just cut and paste from Wikipedia entry on chick flicks.
It just means people are interested in what they go to see.
So if I go to see the Terminator I want a killer robot, I want people running away from it.
I don't want Alan Titmarsh.
Ooh, we get chick flicks. Lucky us.
Quote: Jennie @ July 8 2013, 9:27 PM BSTThat's OK, I never asked you to.
Art reflects society. The fact that so much art fails this very simple test suggests that women are still perceived to have a supporting role in our society.
Sorry yes I missed that part of you asking me to, 
) But there is a point there you are missing. I am saying I don't want to be part of a club.. whatever it is. Women are involved in most of the contemporary powerful , in media sense, depiction of art in a large way was my other point. What Art fails this test in the modern sense.... and DR WHO is not art in any meaningful way - and I agree with some of the points in the article which is why I posted it by the way.
Maths was relating to number of years since feminism as a political ideological artistic force sixties seventies,,, to now. I.e how many years which of course is vague.
Quote: zooo @ July 8 2013, 9:34 PM BSTOoh, we get chick flicks. Lucky us.
Yes and we get action movies, and everyone gets cartoons and films by Woody Allan.
There've been a few female centric actioners Red Sonja, Columbiana and perhaps the one good one The Long Kiss Goodnight.
But they were all kind of odd and not hugely popular.
People watch what they like. Cinema is all about fantasy and I guess guys fantasise about killing the baddy and getting the girl.