Everyone Else Burns

Writers interview

Written by: Jay Richardson
Published: Monday 23rd January 2023

Everyone Else Burns is the debut sitcom created by writers Dillon Mapletoft and Oliver Taylor. The story of a family devoted to a puritanical Christian sect in Manchester, the Channel 4 comedy stars Simon Bird as David, Kate O'Flynn as his wife Fiona, Amy James-Kelly as their daughter Rachel and Harry Connor as their son Aaron.

Co-starring Lolly Adefope, Morgana Robinson, Al Roberts, Liam Williams, Ali Khan, Kadiff Kirwan, Soph Galustian and Arsher Ali among others, the series is made by Jax Media and NBCUniversal International Studios. In the first part of an interview with British Comedy Guide, Mapletoft and Taylor discuss finding the warmth and community in intense religiosity while driving a story forward and keeping the gag count high.

As this is your first series as creators, how are you feeling about Everyone Else Burns coming out?

Taylor: Super excited. I'm still glowing from the press screening. Watching in front of an audience was thrilling. We were nudging each other whenever a gag went well for the other person. And it basically turned into a small fist fight between us.

Mapletoft: All of our insecurities got taken out with those those shoulder punches. It's obviously overwhelming and I feel incredibly grateful to have a show on Channel 4, that was literally a childhood dream. And I'm still pinching myself about the cast we've got. I'm really proud of how it's turned out and I can't wait for the world to see it.

Why did you think a doomsday cult would make a great idea for a sitcom?

Mapletoft: We loved the combination of naturally high narrative stakes. Because if you're extremely religious, everyday scenarios mean different things to you. Things other people wouldn't have a second thought about. So high stakes in terms of life and death, Heaven and Hell. But also a new perspective on coming-of-age moments that hopefully we can all identify with. When you're brought up in that environment, it can give you a different sort of lens.

We went on a writing retreat and started talking about different aspects of my upbringing. We borrowed a few moments that were meaningful to me and created this fictional group we could tailor for the most comic potential. It felt like a great prism to make the show as funny as possible.

It feels like time bombs going off, with the children suddenly exploring their sexuality and the women in the family asserting their independence. Can you elaborate on how it draws from your upbringing Dillon?

Mapletoft: Yeah, as I say, it draws on aspects of me growing up as a fundamentalist Christian. I remember being a 12-year-old kid and terrified of the Apocalypse and we talked about that. But it's still very much fictional. Simon Bird is not my dad, let's be very clear on that. It was a starting point but we built this world together. Having this fictional Christian setting gave us freedom to push the comedy a bit more, to lean into the relatable moments but through the different lens I mentioned.

Were there any narrative inspirations? The initial setup is vaguely reminiscent of Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt but I can't think of a British precursor.

Mapletoft: We always talked about making the lines do their work and having the gag rate of an American show. If you look at some of the shows that NBC or Jax have made, those big hitter American shows where they really pack the jokes in, we aspired to make it a similar level of funny. But with this dry, British sense of humour. I don't remember story-wise having any kind of reference really.

Taylor: We love things like Peep Show, how tight they are and how biting the gags are. But we knew we wanted to make this warmer than something like that. We wanted to find, amidst all the darkness, bleakness, the strife and righteous path and "you'll be cast down", we wanted to use that as shade to emphasise the light. And find, ultimately, the warmth of this dysfunctional family working together to survive in modern times.

There's very much a focus on the family isn't there? Because it would have been easier to make everything about David. Yet they all have substantial narrative arcs, as do quite a few of the supporting characters, and they all tie together. Was that an aim for you from the start?

Taylor: A huge part of this is seeing how four different people react to what this religion has to offer them. So you have David, to whom it's empowering. It gives him a sense of righteous control as the patriarch of the house. And then to someone like Rachel, it's an anxiety-inducing burden. Aaron's just excited for the moment that Earth is going to be consumed by fire and all of his bullies are going to be turned to dust by The Almighty. And Fiona's a long-suffering wife, cosseted by the restrictions placed on her by this religion. From the start we knew the different reactions to the same teachings were a big part of what we wanted to say.

Mapletoft: The religion creates something for certain characters to push against. We wanted Fiona to find some independence and to celebrate that, the journey she goes on when she makes friends with Morgana Robinson's character.

Did you research ultra-religious communities?

Mapletoft: I can certainly say that there are equivalent businesses to Fiona's, for sure, yeah. We researched all of that very heavily. I don't remember trawling through lots of documentaries, we probably started to but because they tend to feel a bit dour, we wanted to move away from that bleakness. We wanted to try to make something as funny as possible.

We didn't want to shy away from the more complex aspects of it. But we wanted to bring out the sense of community as well, the warmth there and the sense that the community is an extended family in some ways. The structure that being part of that kind of organisation gives you. Without the tortured tone that some of those documentaries give you.

Were you involved in casting?

Taylor: We were and we were blown away by the cast we had the opportunity to work with. Kate managed to take a character who could have been very draconian and dark on the page and make her absolutely hysterical. Amy, when we first saw just a still on the casting website, we thought that looks like the sort of timid, anxious, put-upon messiness that we're expecting from Rachel. And sure enough, she captured it perfectly.

And then Harry is our newcomer, playing Aaron, who went from being entirely new to this world, to just being so confident, so committed and smashing every one of those lines. Lines that were full of verbose stuff about the Nephilim and the prophet Elisha. And of course, blown away to have Simon Bird as David, this man cursed with a completely unfair amount of confidence that he's somehow managed to cling on to.

Mapletoft: We should shout out to Aisha Bywaters, our casting director. She was amazing at unearthing talents like Harry, as well as getting these powerhouses like Lolly, Morgana and Kate. I love Kate so much, Kadiff, Arsher, the whole group really.

This is Simon, hopefully, as you've never seen him before. He was amazing, wanting to do something different with this role, really embracing the ways this character is different to the ones he's played before. On set, he really pushed us, in a good way, to wring as much comedy out of it as we could, constantly in dialogue with us about lines. When you're working with a bunch of amazing comedians you want to be receptive to what they can bring to the table. And we tried to adapt accordingly when they were cast. Having Lolly in her role for example, she totally made it her own with her own take.

Was part of the pitch to Simon that his character gets to grow a bit over the series? Without being disrespectful, something a bit different to the more cartoonish characters he's played before?

Mapletoft: What Simon says drew him to the script was the joke count. We tried to make it dense in terms of gags. But he can be underestimated at times, he's got incredible range and really cares about the craft of it, the grind of it too, milking the comedy as much as possible. All of us, Simon included, found it exciting to push him in a different direction. We hope his character is still endearing. He's definitely not the snarky, smartest guy in the room that he might have been in other shows.

Was it difficult striking a balance with that emphasis on gag count? Because at the same time you're spinning a number of love stories and building towards an ending.

Taylor: We were very aware that we're trying to do a great deal. And that was an exciting challenge. We didn't necessarily feel that the weightiness, the tension or the difficulty of somebody straying from the righteous path, being excluded or thinking that the Apocalypse is coming, we didn't feel that was working against the love narrative or the comedy. In fact, we feel that that's what makes those things pop. When you're aware those tensions exist, it just becomes more exciting and funnier as well. So those things aren't pulling in different directions, they're part of the tone we're trying to create.

Mapletoft: The tone was collaborative in a really great way. Channel 4 have got this amazing record of taking something that might seem a little bit niche, maybe on the surface, and then opening it up and finding what's universal in it. The whole development team, the comedy department, together with Jax and NBC, just helped guide us to the more relatable and warmer moments.

We always wanted there to be a narrative arc there. But we also wanted to anchor at least most of the episodes in a story-of-the-week style way. Which is definitely a difficult hybrid to be aiming for. Because you've got to be thinking what's the main event this episode? But also, how are we pushing the story forward? We got great direction and support on the script front of that.

Some of the cast were also amazing at freeing up their roles a little bit. Once we saw what Kate was able to do with Fiona and how she was playing it, it allowed us to be more adventurous and push the character in a different direction. Because her delivery is so brilliant, we felt that we could get away with her saying certain things that were a bit more cutting.

Liam Williams plays tortured soul very well. And the outcome of Lolly's storyline, the way that came about, was brilliant. Comedy fans ought to recognise many in the supporting cast. But did you know many of them well beforehand?

Mapletoft: Genuinely, the whole group, we've admired in different ways. People like Lolly, Liam, Al, we've watched their stage shows and thought they were amazing. When we were writing Joel, Liam came to mind straightaway. Lolly, we really wanted her to look at the role. But when she actually came and did it, it was better than either of us had imagined it would be. With Kate, it's not just Landscapers. I remember seeing her 10 years ago in an independent film and she was very funny, as well as seeing her in some stage stuff. Kadiff from This Is Going To Hurt, they all kind of popped. Every person joining the team, we were just looking at each other thinking, this is incredible.

With your medical, scientific background Oliver, I might have anticipated more criticism of religion in the show. But it's very tender and understanding of what religion might offer someone like Joel, someone a little bit lost. David has many ridiculous aspects. But you're not just laughing at them are you?

Taylor: It's absolutely a communal show, a family show, where we're talking about different people's reactions to these teachings. Those who find it helpful and positive, those who rush up against it, find it burdensome and difficult, anxiety-inducing, all of those things. We never approach any topic with a view to being didactic, we always want to explore all aspects so it can feel rich and nuanced, so we can take something away from it. In medicine, one of the things you're taught constantly is compassion in your communication skills and just how difficult it can be to care for other people, to have their best interests at heart. That warmth was at the heart of what we wanted to get across.

You have a cameo in the series Dillon, essentially saying "fuck off" to religion. How do you feel about it now?

Mapletoft: We feel like the least interesting perspective on anything is looking down on it. Oli and I have different beliefs and ways of looking at things. But ultimately, we always want the warmth to come through and look at these things compassionately. I don't want to name and shame anyone, but I remember as a kid watching shows or stand-up sets that were really attacking religion in a kind of punching down way and feeling really awful, small and kind of humiliated. We never wanted to do anything like that. We didn't want to shy away from the complexity but we wanted to celebrate aspects of this idiosyncratic world as well.

Even so, there's a darkness running throughout the show isn't there? Beyond the abstract Heaven and Hell stuff, there are people being cut off from their families.

Mapletoft: Yeah, absolutely. Without wanting to spoil the show, when Kate acts the way she does in Episode 6, she really feels that she's doing what's best for her daughter. Nothing is black and white or clear-cut. They're all working from different perspectives, believing in different ways. They're doing the right thing most of the time. David's well-meaning maybe 40% of the time but he comes round in the end.

Taylor: We're definitely fascinated by a kind of community that's perhaps been lost from the rest of wider society, whereby if you're an insular community, perhaps more separated or cut-off, it probably means the ties that bind you are stronger.

The series ends in a way that makes you keen to know where it's going next. Do you have storylines in mind for a second series?

Mapletoft: We absolutely do, we really hope we get to do more. As we've talked about, we always wanted there to be a lot of story there, as well as this kind of story-of-the-week feel. There are so many places we want to go with these characters and so many of the characters we want to get to know more. We really hope we get to see that. But as with all TV, I guess it's down to algorithms these days.

For additional discussion with the duo, see the BCG Pro interview