Patriarchy or matriarchy Page 2

Really? We have no industrry our military is an interoperative spare for the US, our economy depends on us acting as a tax haven for mega corporations who despise us.

Our work force is one of the least educated, incapable ones in the world.

The majority of our jobs are in service industry, which means they produce precisely nothing.

If we left the EU we'd be the new North Korea in a year.

Frankly I'm delighted to be part of a monolithic, soul less european uber state. Providing we can keep every one else out.

Also the Human rights act cleared up problems in our own legislation that our pitiful legislature had failed to do for years.

To be honest I'm glad to be part of the EU because they're better than we deserve.

Trading alliances are fine, but nations need their sovereignty and once you start talking about a common military, currency, laws and government you're removing their sense of identity and pride and the people begin to feel as if they're losing control of their own destiny.

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:30 PM BST

Also the Human rights act cleared up problems in our own legislation that our pitiful legislature had failed to do for years.

To be honest I'm glad to be part of the EU because they're better than we deserve.

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You are a mentalist, and I claim my £5.

Quote: DaButt @ August 31 2008, 4:31 PM BST

Trading alliances are fine, but nations need their sovereignty and once you start talking about a common military, currency, laws and government you're removing their sense of identity and pride and the people begin to feel as if they're losing control of their own destiny.

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Well said.

Quote: Aaron @ August 31 2008, 4:30 PM BST

Nothing wrong with a trading alliance. In fact, I wholeheartedly support it. But that's not what the EU is any longer.

And as for your "small and weak" accusation of the UK, were we not within the EU - or more to the point, were it not in the form it is in today - then the situation would be entirely different.

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The British economy died in 1929, we were poorer than the US during the Great Depression. In some ways we were actually broker than Weimer era Germany.

Thing is we never got out of that funk.

We were lucky that socialist Labour policies on reinvestment. just, and only just coincided with our admitance into the Common Market.

Quote: DaButt @ August 31 2008, 4:31 PM BST

Trading alliances are fine, but nations need their sovereignty and once you start talking about a common military, currency, laws and government you're removing their sense of identity and pride and the people begin to feel as if they're losing control of their own destiny.

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I don't think so, I'm a patriotic person and proud (most of the time) to be British - just things such as pooling resources is something I can eventually see happening, and I don't really see it as a bad thing, then again all of this comes with shades of grey.

Thing is the reason the UK were not able to really join the EDF (which is has always and will always be a joke)is our military is already part of the US. It's called interopeartive and it means we can only carry out meaningful military operations with US support.

Our foreign policy has been mated to the US evere since Labour's been in power. In fairness Thatcher maintaned a strongly UK centric foreign policy (apart from Cruise and even then she was right).

I'm a proEuropean socialist, Thatcherite I'm even more confused than her!

See the Labor party has made our foreign policy such a spineless adjunct to the US. We may as well scrap the whole military and save 40 billion pounds a year.

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:40 PM BST

our military is already part of the US. It's called interopeartive and it means we can only carry out meaningful military operations with US support.

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That's a bunch of crap.

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:30 PM BST

Really? We have no industrry our military is an interoperative spare for the US, our economy depends on us acting as a tax haven for mega corporations who despise us.

Our work force is one of the least educated, incapable ones in the world.

The majority of our jobs are in service industry, which means they produce precisely nothing.

If we left the EU we'd be the new North Korea in a year.

Frankly I'm delighted to be part of a monolithic, soul less european uber state. Providing we can keep every one else out.

Also the Human rights act cleared up problems in our own legislation that our pitiful legislature had failed to do for years.

To be honest I'm glad to be part of the EU because they're better than we deserve.

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Sooty you're talking crap, We have a large service sector yes, but why are you saying that like it's a bad thing?

The city has literally billions and billion of pounds flowing through it, and that's because we have one of the best finacial sectors in the world.

The same for military when push comes to shove we have the resources to take on a lot of superpowers, in theory we have 14 million people able and "fit" to fight in a war - the only reason we put in aout 2% of our GDP is because we have no need to plow more into it, we put more money in health sectors and home grown programs (E.G. welfare).

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:40 PM BST

EDF (which is has always and will always be a joke)

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Ugh, I know. Have you actually seen their prices recently?!

Quote: Paul W @ August 31 2008, 4:45 PM BST

Sooty you're talking crap, We have a large service sector yes, but why are you saying that like it's a bad thing?

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It's not bad in itself. The problem, and what he is trying to say, is that we actually produce very little ourselves. Check almost anything in your house, and it'll have been made in Taiwan, Japan, China, India... 50 years ago, such a state of dependency would have been unthinkable. We have let ourselves fall into a situation where we rely on and require outside help. And again, that isn't bad in itself, but it does require international co-operation and good relations with other countries.

A fabulos banking industry made up of predominantly none UK nationals and companies. Who bank here for the same reason they bank in Switzerland and Jersey. A weak fawning government that barely taxes them at all.

Dear God 14 million able bodies Brits for time of war? That would be funny in a bitterly ironic sort of way.

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:50 PM BST

A fabulos banking industry made up of predominantly none UK nationals and companies. Who bank here for the same reason they bank in Switzerland and Jersey. A weak fawning government that barely taxes them at all.

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There's a big difference between banking and financial services, which is what Paul was talking about.

And 2% of GDP is double most European powers, except I think France.

Those cheese eating none-surrender monkeys.

Apparently all this will change when we get our new aircraft carriers.

Watch out world we're back grrr!

I say we recapture India then South Africa, maybe the American colonies.....

I'm sure the Canadians would help.

Quote: Aaron @ August 31 2008, 4:50 PM BST

It's not bad in itself. The problem, and what he is trying to say, is that we actually produce very little ourselves. Check almost anything in your house, and it'll have been made in Taiwan, Japan, China, India... 50 years ago, such a state of dependency would have been unthinkable.

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True, but we have a smaller land mass, therefore we can't rely on agriculture and sustaining ourselves as much as other countries (barely did it during the war and the population was a lot lower), but you also have to consider weather conditions as well.

Quote: Aaron @ August 31 2008, 4:53 PM BST

There's a big difference between banking and financial services, which is what Paul was talking about.

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But the same principle none UK companies with little regulation.

Quote: sootyj @ August 31 2008, 4:50 PM BST

Dear God 14 million able bodies Brits for time of war? That would be funny in a bitterly ironic sort of way.

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I'm talking worst case here sooty, world war 3, if we pretty much had to bang down doors and drag people out, we'd have 14 million at our disposal.