I think i may be ruining the discussion for everybody to be honest 'cos i haven't actually watched this year's CBB so I'm basing what I say on the reports of the 'incidents'.
I agree Aaron that saying "liar" and what-have-you is not racist, but I read the quote as being: "that's why they're all so thin, they don't wash their hands then they eat with them and get ill". If I'm wrong, I'm sorry.
I think the thing which most disturbs me about this situation is that as I hinted upon earlier, Jade Goody is the one of the bunch who has made the comments LEAST akin to "racism", and yet she is (and was, even whilst in the house) the one getting the majority of the criticism. She was having screaming rows with Shilpa undoubtedly, but the most shocking of the comments came from the other two girls involved; Jo and primarily theonewhoIdon'tknow.
Either way, racist or not, what's gone on in that house over the past couple of weeks will, I hope, lead to an end for this utter drivel of a programme once and for all.
Quote: Scott T @ January 22, 2007, 1:28 PMI agree Aaron that saying "liar" and what-have-you is not racist, but I read the quote as being: "that's why they're all so thin, they don't wash their hands then they eat with them and get ill". If I'm wrong, I'm sorry.
Ah yes, I think that that was said too, yes. One of the few comments which I would consider to be racist. But even then it shows pure and utter stupidity rather than malice. (I don't think that Jade was part of that particular conversation though, was she? I have a feeling it was just Jo and theotherone. But yes, either way.)
However, we should really be pitying and attempting to educate these 'girls' rather than attacking them. It'll only turn them even more reactionary and grow any racism within them.
Oh this getting really silly. For actual racism go and join the KKK and burn a cross, or become best mates with a preacher of hate at the local mosque wanting to see anyone of the wrong race, colour or creed dead. You could, of course, nip over the border where all Englishmen will be subjected to absolute racial abuse because the Scot's are very vocal about how they feel about the English.
Ireland on the other hand don't suffer racism because they only have sectarianism. I bet that makes life a whole lot better for the Protestants and Catholics. In fact, now I come to think about it, the only people on the planet who can ever be racist are the English, and shame on anybody stupid enough to think otherwise.
Jade Goody is a vile, bigoted dog but is she really racist?
Unfortunately, one does not need to nip over the border. Look at the Government - almost entirely Scottish. Blair, Brown, Reid, Falconer. The four biggest names, and not one is English. They perpetuate enough power and racism alone to overwhelm everything else.
You should really talk to Mark and myself though Baumski. Sounds like we'd get along. 
Quote: Baumski @ January 22, 2007, 3:31 PMFor actual racism go and join the KKK and burn a cross, or become best mates with a preacher of hate at the local mosque wanting to see anyone of the wrong race, colour or creed dead.
Racism's not just about that, it's in people's day to day lives like casual comments about 'them lot'. TV has a big influence on people's day to day behaviour.
Quote: Aaron @ January 22, 2007, 1:43 PMAh yes, I think that that was said too, yes. One of the few comments which I would consider to be racist.
If a show contains "a few" racist comments, that's too many for me. Maybe I'm oversensitive or unfashionably PC but I don't like that at all.
Everyone's a little bit racist
Sometimes.
Doesn't mean we go
Around committing hate crimes.
Look around and you will find
No one's really color blind.
Maybe it's a fact
We all should face
Everyone makes judgments
Based on race.
...
If we all could just admit
That we are racist a little bit,
Even though we all know
That it's wrong,
Maybe it would help us
Get along.
Wise words honky.
The interesting thing about the whole bullying thing is that Jade is probably going to emerge from it an even bigger star. The first stage of her media campaign outside the house consisted of contrition, which she did very well, crying and talking about her children, she's now positioning herself as a victim, talking about how she's the target of a hate campaign. She'll be back on magazine covers and TV shows in no time.
Quote: Jay72 @ January 17, 2007, 7:59 PMThe only way I'll ever watch that pile of s**te is if somebody has a gun to my head.
Even then I wouldn't watch. But if they put a gun to the has-beens in there. Different story. I'd pay my licence fee.
Racism is a focus on ascribing characteristics / traits (particularly negative conotations) to a person solely because they belong to a particular group. However, it's not an easy distinction. Are the comments re: 'They never this' or 'They're all thin because' racist or applying a stereotype, or both? Is saying 'All Scots are tight' or 'All Welsh shag sheep' racism or stereotyping? Would the media have gotten so involved if it were comments about Scots / Welsh / Irish?
It is a messy and difficult debate. That it was a national debate we needed to have is a feeble post-fallout TV executive excuse. Yes, maybe so, board of governors, but debate it properly, not vicariously via some foul-mouthed yobs who couldn't correctly write down the number of noughts in their bank accounts.
I'm guessing the answer lies in if our attitudes towards a person changes (positively or negatively) because we know their racial or cultural roots then this is classed as racism.
I once got involved in a discussion on racism in the West and was told that as I was a 'white male' my opinion was worthless. Racism is a two-edged sword, it isn't a disease of one group. All sides of every racial divide are equally culpable and equally capable of racism. If Africa had invented gunpowder first then they would have colonised Europe and the race riots of Sixties America would have raged in Ghana and the Congo as ex white slave populations sought emancipation. Slavery was a result of imbalance of power. Wherever imbalance lies, so to does the desire to exploit. Also, the East is just as guilty of demonising the West. Compare the thankful lack of public outrage against minorities living in the West after 9/11 with the total outrage showered on every European nation after a few cartoons were published in Denmark.
I am pleased to count friends across the great spectrum of the World's cultures and religions. Difference is something to enjoy. As Aaron rightly pointed out above, racism taints everyone but is a global disease of attitude not a disease associated with a particular location or people group.
Please, this is a SITCOM forum. I can't escape from Big Brother. I didn't mind it when it first started, but I can't stand it now, it's not reality anymore. You turn on the news, BIG BROTHER, I like to watch Question Time on a Thursday night, surprise surprise, the main talking point is BIG BROTHER. This is a sitcom forum, so why do we have to talk about BIG BROTHER.
i think there is a fine line between, racism, being patriotic and stereotypes, calling a french person (for example) names could be classed as being patriotic, the big brother quotes are against one person, i feel it isn't intentional more stupidity, that just mignt be my understanding though, it's sad that people need something on big brother that is racist to make them feel outraged about the issue when it is in the world 24/7, but i agree with jack, it's everywhere, and now there is another one that is hitting the news. thats my moan over
There's a show called 'Avenue Q' which is on in London. It's a Muppet show with teeth and there is an outstanding song that I wish I’d written called 'We're All A Little Bit Racist' and it hits the nail right on the head. It doesn't matter if you're black, white or any other colour of the rainbow because everyone is racist - fact.
People hate 'Love Thy Neighbour' without ever getting the point. They all point the finger at the white guy and say that character was racist because he called the black guy 'sambo' and 'nig nog'. How great it would be if they could also remember that the black guy called the white guy 'honky' and 'snowdrop'. The women though – strangely also one black and one white - were the picture of racial harmony because both the guys were as bad as each other. That's just the way things are scribes, and the sooner people deal with it the sooner we can call off the witch-hunt and move on.
And in case anyone is STILL in any doubt, vent your anger towards Channel 4 because they're the real gits. They knew what they were doing when they put Jade in the house and have been celebrating ever since.
Quote: SlagA @ January 24, 2007, 1:08 PMI once got involved in a discussion on racism in the West and was told that as I was a 'white male' my opinion was worthless. Racism is a two-edged sword, it isn't a disease of one group. All sides of every racial divide are equally culpable and equally capable of racism. If Africa had invented gunpowder first then they would have colonised Europe and the race riots of Sixties America would have raged in Ghana and the Congo as ex white slave populations sought emancipation. Slavery was a result of imbalance of power. Wherever imbalance lies, so to does the desire to exploit. Also, the East is just as guilty of demonising the West. Compare the thankful lack of public outrage against minorities living in the West after 9/11 with the total outrage showered on every European nation after a few cartoons were published in Denmark.
Very well said. I grew up in one of the most 'multi-cultural' areas of the country, where as a white person I was the ethnic minority. I can not recall a single occasion when I saw or heard of (save the obvious odd newspaper article) racism from a white person to an Indian, Asian, or other so-called 'minority'. Quite contrary in fact; pretty constant, never-ending racism from Asians against white people at all levels. And, thinking about it now, almost exclusively from Muslims. So there you go. Really very rarely hear about that side of things. But anyway.
Quote: Baumski @ January 24, 2007, 4:16 PMThere's a show called 'Avenue Q' which is on in London. It's a Muppet show with teeth and there is an outstanding song that I wish I’d written called 'We're All A Little Bit Racist' and it hits the nail right on the head.
Not been reading through the previous posts, have we?