Newbie seeking comments (good or bad!)

Hello all, I'm a new arrival on the forums (will submit a post about myself in Introductions soon) looking for some advice on the sitcom I'm currently writing. I'm awaiting feedback on a script I posted off to The Comedy Unit, and given that I don't expect feedback to come for a little while yet, I'm interested in seeing whether people other than my family and friends think my work is actually funny. This seems a good place to start, so I've decided to post part of a scene from the first episode of my sitcom. Btw I've written one full episode - episode one - and am nearly finished writing the second episode.

I won't bore you with every single detail about the show I'm writing, suffice it to say that its set in a cinema, and the main characters are two brothers who don't get along very well. Nicky has just returned from Oxford to see his dying grandfather, and hasn't exactly been welcomed with open arms by his brother Will. I know feuding brothers is not the most original of ideas, but the bad blood between the brothers is really just a catalyst for starting the series, as it goes in a totally different direction after the first episode, while keeping their relationship at the heart of the show.

In the scene I've pasted in below, Nicky is taken to the cinema in which Will works. The relationship is still quite tense, for reasons we discover later in the first episode. By this point, we know that Nicky has been gone for just over 2 years, and has only made infrequent calls to his mother. This scene takes place on location, but I would like this series to be filmed mostly in a studio, and I don't have a preference really whether its filmed with or without an audience.

Any advice, criticism, praise etc will be much appreciated! Hope you like it!

__________________________________

Nicky:
So…um…When did you leave your job at the card shop?

Will:
Oh I left Johnson’s about a year and half ago. This mad bloke bought it over and renamed it Nixon’s. I got offered the chance to stay on but as I say, he was a bit mad. I think he thought he actually was Richard Nixon. Weird guy all together.

Nicky:
(Chuckles) That’s three card shops I can think of with the name of former U.S. Presidents.

Will:
(Laughs) I never noticed that. Johnson then Nixon. I can’t think of another one though. Was there a President Birthdays?

Nicky:
(Flatly) No. I meant Clintons.

(Will laughs raucously, Nicky looks sort of embarrassed)

Nicky:
(After an awkward pause) So, where do you work now?

Will:
You’re looking at it. (Will points. We see a cinema on the other side of a main road as cars go by. It’s old-fashioned, art deco, but a bit rundown)

Nicky:
Is that a cinema?

Will:
It is indeed. Welcome to The Cameo cinema! (When Will says the above, we see an Alfred Hitchcock look-a-like walk past the cinema) Well, what do you think?

Nicky:
I think I went there to see Jurassic Park and my seat collapsed half way through the film. I’m sure that’s it. I can't believe I remember this, but I'm sure the foyer carpet had this massive burn mark where someone had stamped out a cigarette on it.

Will:
Hey, you’re right! That mark is still there! What a good memory you have, except for small details...like your home address (N scowls). Come on, I’ll take you on a guided tour.

Nicky:
Oh, there’s no need.

Will:
Come on. We came out to bond.

Nicky:
Did we? I came out for some triple A batteries and a bit of fresh air.

(Will hits him on the arm)

Will:
Come on. This is a good way to get to know each other again.

Nicky:
(Droll) Can’t we just hold hands?

Will:
(Does OTT gay impression) Ooh! I think Oxfam turned you gay, little brother!

Nicky:
It’s Oxford. And I was born first.

(They stop outside the double doors, which are light brown with gold rails.)

Nicky:
What films are they showing today?

Will:
It tells you up on the sign.

(Nicky stands back and looks up at the sign. There are very tiny letters attached to an old-fashioned cinema sign with a white, lined background).

Nicky:
I can’t read that, it’s miniscule. (Will stares at him blankly) I mean the letters are very small.

Will:
Oh right. Yeah, well somebody stole the letters we usually put up, and because we had none left, we had to stick fridge magnets up there until the new batch arrives.

(Nicky looks again, straining)

Nicky:
Has nobody complained? They are awfully small.

Will:
I don’t think so. Not everybody is as picky as you are. (Nicky raises his eyebrows) Now before we go in, prepare for a surprise.

Nicky:
What is it?

Will:
You’ll never guess who owns this.

Nicky:
Who?

Will:
Guess.

Nicky:
Why guess? You could just tell me.

Will:
(Laughs) I’m not going to tell you until you guess.

Nicky:
(Miffed) Is it David Bowie? Does David Bowie own it?

Will:
What kind of a guess is that? That’s just madness.

Nicky:
He could have bought it on a whim; you know, maybe he was passing through town, the car stopped at the traffic lights and he thought “wow, I really need to buy that shitty old abandoned cinema over there. It would really compliment my sixteen mansions”.

Will:
What a cheap snob. It’s not manky, it’s got character.

Nicky:
Well, I won’t argue with you on that, it does have character. Stig of the Dump being the first character which springs to mind.

Will:
(Ignoring him) When you said David Bowie, you were on the right tracks. It’s a famous person. (Pauses) Will I just tell you?

Nicky:
See, this is exactly why I never guess. There are six billion people on the planet and that’s the odds for picking the right person. Then the person asking you to guess gets bored of waiting and tells you anyway. You could have saved oodles of time just by telling me at the start.

Will:
Ok, you don’t like the guessing game.

Nicky:
I don’t. I don’t like the waiting game either. Or The Generation Game. Well, it depends who the host it.

Will:
Right. Well, the owner is...Mick Malone! (Grins) I work for the Mick Malone. Can you believe that?

Nicky:
(Mocking tone) No, that’s unbelievable! I can’t believe that! (Pause) Who’s the Mick Malone?

Will:
(Tuts) I see Oxfam taught you to have no manners either.

Nicky:
Oxford.

Will:
Mick used to be on TV. He was big in the 80s. You must remember him?!

Nicky:
I didn’t watch much TV in the 80s. Funnily enough, I was too busy being born and stuff like that.

Will:
He used to be on that show. Don’t you remember?

Nicky:
What show?

Will:
You know the one.

Nicky:
Are we playing the guessing game again?

Will:
I can’t remember the name of it. It's got a funny title. Come on, we’ll ask him.

Nicky:
I'll just wait here until you get back.

Will:
No, come on in. I'll get you his autograph.

Nicky:
I don't even know who he is, Will!

Will:
When has that ever stopped you from getting a freebie?

Nicky:
Good point. Lead the way!

(They open the double doors leading into the cinema foyer. The doors shut heavily behind them. The camera focused on the cinema facade, we see some of the fridge magnets fall off of the sign to the ground).

END OF SCENE

Interesting enough but I'm afraid I didn't find it funny - it reads more like drama than sitcom. Some of the dialogue could do with paring down e.g. Will's first line could be "Johnsons? A year and a half ago. etc"

Hi DM

I liked this but didn't really get into it until half-way through the scene. I think that this was because it's a bit over written and stodgy earlier on and I could feel the crowbar having been used to get one or two of the gags in there.

But when it settled down I enjoyed it. I liked the Alfred Hitchcock visual and also the fridge magnets.

It's not a gagfest but there were enough laughs to keep me interested and I like that. Sometimes gag gag gag can be wearing and unnatural and I, as a viewer, am prepared to go with something that has a light feel but is funny occasionally.

Badge may have a point and this could be a comedy drama but without seeing more then it’s a bit hard to tell.

My advice would be to watch the over writing and cut down on a lot of the () beside speeches. I have been told that if the dialogue's written correctly then the actors will know how to interpret the lines as that's their job.

But I did enjoy it.

Cheers B

PS I think it’s posted in the wrong section and it should be under critique because you will probably get more reads / responses if it’s there

Hi DM

First off, Blenkinsop is right -- you'll need to post this in the 'Critique' forum as you'll get more reads. Unless one of the admins is kind enough to move it across? Pretty please, admins

Over on that forum you'll find a couple of threads pinned at the top which will help you lots ('Here Be Pirates' and 'Rough Idea'). If you follow them right through there's plenty of discussion about gags, plot, character, which episode you should write first, etc and is worth the investment for the half-hour/hour it takes to read through them.

I think specifically you should read the bit about 'which episode should come first' as you're writing the first (character-setting) episode first and writing other episodes (where the character set-up is not as important and more emphasis in on plot) may be a better way to learn and understand your characters.

A lot of people here seem to get the same advice, so here it is again, for all you that missed it

I admit this may be a personal bug-bear of mine and am aware that not everyone here agrees with me but I don't think anyone should have to post any sort of character explanation before their writing; I think your characters' character should come out in your writing. I should *know* that there's bad blood between the brothers from their attitudes to each other from your script, not from your synopsis. And I didn't get that from the script -- they seem to be more joking around like any siblings more than there actually be any bad feeling. I think you need to work on this if that's how you want them to be. (From my opinion, I think they will be a lot more interesting *not* getting on, than being all matey how-all-brothers-are kind of thing)

You're writing too much. It reads like you're talking with your mate and having a bit of banter and for all the fun that is for you, it can get a bit tedious for a reader so you need to get to your points quicker.

For instance, you wrote:

Nicky:
So…um…When did you leave your job at the card shop?

Will:
Oh I left Johnson’s about a year and half ago. This mad bloke bought it over and renamed it Nixon’s. I got offered the chance to stay on but as I say, he was a bit mad. I think he thought he actually was Richard Nixon. Weird guy all together.

Nicky:
(Chuckles) That’s three card shops I can think of with the name of former U.S. Presidents.

Will:
(Laughs) I never noticed that. Johnson then Nixon. I can’t think of another one though. Was there a President Birthdays?

Nicky:
(Flatly) No. I meant Clintons.

I reckon you should be writing something like:

Nicky:
When did you leave the card shop?

Will:
About a year ago when some mad bloke bought it. He renamed it from Johnson's to Nixon’s. He actually thought he was Richard Nixon!

Nicky:
Why do all these former presidents open card shops?

Will:
(Laughs) Johnsons, Nixons (PAUSE, CONFUSED) Erm... Birthdays?

Nicky:
(Flatly) No. I meant Clintons.

as it flows better and gets to the point quicker. Another example:

Nicky:
What films are they showing today?

Will:
It tells you up on the sign.

(Nicky stands back and looks up at the sign. There are very tiny letters attached to an old-fashioned cinema sign with a white, lined background).

Nicky:
I can’t read that, it’s miniscule. (Will stares at him blankly) I mean the letters are very small.

Will:
Oh right. Yeah, well somebody stole the letters we usually put up, and because we had none left, we had to stick fridge magnets up there until the new batch arrives.

(Nicky looks again, straining)

Nicky:
Has nobody complained? They are awfully small.

Will:
I don’t think so. Not everybody is as picky as you are. (Nicky raises his eyebrows) Now before we go in, prepare for a surprise.

Nicky:
What is it?

Will:
You’ll never guess who owns this.

Nicky:
Who?

should be something like:

Nicky:
Now, what films are on?

(Nicky stands back and looks up at the sign. There are very tiny letters attached to an old-fashioned cinema sign with a white, lined background).

Nicky:
The letters are very small.

Will:
Somebody stole the letters for the board. We've had to use fridge magnets instead.

(Nicky looks again, straining)

Will:
You’ll never guess who owns this.

Nicky:
Who?

You've done it quite a lot all through your script and this sort of editing should speed up your episode. The extra dialogue feels like it's slowing it down. Remember, get to your point quickly.

Your plot for the first episode needs to come out quicker. I don't know what it is as it reads as just a bit of observation comedy rather than a sitcom. (I'm assuming this is the first scene of the sitcom though.) Normally when I say this, there is a post back saying 'The plot actually is blah blah blah' and we don't want a post saying that, we want to find it out in the script itself, as it is naturally uncovered.

I think you have an ability to write comedy but you're treating like a conversation you'd have with your mates. That's a good starting point, you just need to hone it, cut the excess words and get to your point quicker.

Layout is very good and easy to read. Well done.

Hope this is helpful.

Dan

I don't think I can add anything to the above, the guys seem to have got it covered.

Thanks guys for your advice, you make good points about writing too much. I can see how some lines could easily lose a couple of words. I do favour the conversational style, as I'm not a huge fan of sitcoms that rely on gag,gag,gag. Curb Your Enthusiasm manages to do conversational humour well, and it was only recently that I learned that the whole thing is tightly scripted, which surprised me. I think the choice of actors can really infuse a script with the sort of emotions and facial expressions that aren't necessarily written down in detail, and thats probably why Curb works, because Larry's working with real-life friends.

I wouldn't class my script as a comedy drama, I've seen at least three sitcoms that spring to mind (Frasier, One Foot In The Grave and Only Fools) that were able to balance comedy and drama on a regular basis but still remain sitcoms. Frasier in particular influences me, when I think back to the early episodes and the strained relationship between Frasier and his dad Martin. I'm aiming for that level of tension that can still produce gags, and I'll admit the scene I pasted in wasn't perhaps the best example of the brother's relationship. This is touched upon much more in a scene later in the episode. I won't be pasting the whole script in this forum but I'll paste in new material from time to time, mainly to just see if people find what I'm writing funny. I won't claim to have every single detail of every episode planned out extensively, but I do know what each character represents, how they react to things and situations differently, and where each of their individual and joint storylines is going. I will certainly take on board the advice I have read on these forums, and I've read over the two threads recommended by swerytd.

The scene pasted in below immediately follows the scene I initially posted, where we meet the third main character, Mick, for the first time. Hope you enjoy!
_____________________________________________

CUT TO: CINEMA FOYER

Will:
There he is. (We see Mick, a man in his mid to late 40s, giving a customer their change) Ring any bells?

Nicky:
He looks a bit familiar, yeah. Is he the bloke from Manimal?

Will:
Dunno. Hey, Mick!

Nicky:
Oh, no, that’s fine. No need to disturb him.

Mick:
Will, I didn’t know you were working today.

Will:
I’m not, but I thought I would drop by for a specific reason.

Mick:
What’s that?

Will:
I’ve got someone...special to introduce you to. He’s been waiting for years to meet you. (Nicky looks at Will) This is Nicky.

Mick:
Oh is...are you? (Shakes his hand and in doing so pulls him up close) Nice to meet...eh, just out of curiosity, do you know where and when you were conceived?

Nicky:
Why?!

Mick:
I can tell you what I was doing that night. Just give me the date and I’ll prove it.

Will:
Is this like a memory game?

Mick:
Yeah.

Will:
It’s not the guessing game; you’re safe!

Nicky:
Um...I don’t know the exact date. I was born in June 1984, so I would have been conceived nine months earlier. September or October 1983.

Mick:
Right. (Thinking) What was I doing? Well, I wasn’t doing your mother that night, or any night for that matter. Sorry for your wasted journey. (Goes to walk off)

Nicky:
What the hell...?

Mick:
I’m sorry, son, and when I say son I’m being friendly, not committal. Whatever your mother told you, I’m not your father. I had the snip the day you were conceived, the very day.

Nicky:
I didn’t tell you what the date was!

Mick:
That’s right, it was that day. I couldn’t walk for a week, or lie on my front. Even now the scars...

Will:
Mick, this is my brother! I don’t know what you...

Mick:
He’s your brother?

Will:
Yeah.

Mick:
(Hugs Nicky) Oh thank God! Thank you! (Kisses Nicky on the forehead)

Nicky:
(Pushing him off) Are you insane? Actually, let me just rearrange the ‘are’ and ‘you’ words in that sentence!

Mick:
Sorry, allow me to explain.

Nicky:
I’m all ears!

Mick:
A few years back I kept receiving letters from some kid claiming to be my secret love child. My mates told me it was an obsessed fan but this person knew everything about me, even my inside leg measurement. I did the responsible thing and moved countries. I thought for a minute Will was pulling a Cilla Black on me!

Nicky:
Right, well...

Mick:
You’re the son I never had! (Laughs loudly) Okay, lets rewind to the start. Your Will’s brother. (Grabs Nicky’s shoulders with each hand) Now that I look at you, you do look quite alike. Except you’ve got that wee ginger beard thing going on.

Nicky:
It’s just the way the light...

Mick:
Will’s brother, eh! You never told me you had a brother! What’s your name again, son? Non-son! (Laughs madly)

Nicky:
It’s Nicky.

Mick:
Nicky! That’s a nice name. Is that short for Nicodemus?

Nicky:
No, Nicholas.

Mick:
Oh, of course. Nicholas. I’m sorry, I’ve been reading The Bible.

Will:
Mick recently converted to Christianity. He’s found God.

Nicky:
Oh, where was he? (Laughs, Mick doesn’t)

Mick:
(Puts his hand on Nicky’s shoulder) Son, what you must understand is, I went through a period of re-evaluating my life, after my TV show got cancelled. I went nuts for awhile. (Takes his hand away) I became an alcoholic, I was hooked on painkillers and I did a lot of women, and I mean a lot. I had them coming out of my ears at one point. (Nicky grimaces and brushes with his hand the spot where Mick’s hand rested on his shoulder) I abused my fame, but then I found the church, and they helped me back on the bandwagon. I bought this place and you know what they say, the rest will be in my autobiography! (Laughs, punches Nicky on arm playfully) Would you like my autograph, by the way?

(Will nudges Nicky, they exchange looks. Mick looks expectant)

Nicky:
Sure, ok. That would be...nice.

Mick:
Lucky I had these publicity photos at hand. (He flashes a picture of himself, younger, pulling a James Bond style pose) Ok, here’s a pen. (Speaks aloud while he writes) “To Nicky...all the best...Mick Malone”. (Clicks pen, laughs) There you go!

Nicky:
Er, thanks.

Mick:
That’ll be five pounds.

Nicky:
You want me to pay for this?

Mick:
Yes. I always charge a fiver per autograph. My rate's cheaper than Nicholas Parsons', you know!

Nicky:
Excuse me a minute. (Leads Will to side) Is this some sort of twisted joke?

Will:
You heard what he said. His life’s been a disaster. Give him a break.

Nicky:
(Pause) Ok, but after this lets get out of this place. (To Mick) Ok, here you go. Five pounds.

Mick:
(Solemn face) Thank you. (Pause, then laughs) Ah, I had you going there, didn’t I?!

(Nicky starts to laugh too. Mick hands him the autograph but pockets the fiver)

Will:
Mick’s a real joker.

Nicky:
Yeah...

Will:
I was trying to remember what show it was you were in, Mick.

Mick:
How could you forget? It was Glebe Street. It ran for seven years, and it was a soap opera about neighbours in a Dundee cul-de-sac. Did you see it, Nicky?

Nicky:
I don’t think so. Has it been repeated?

Mick:
No. Those bastards, God forgive my language. I mean the bad type of bastard by the way, not the type of bastard I thought you were.

Nicky:
Oh. Am I a good bastard?

Mick:
Yes. This was the bad type. They said my show is unrepeatable. I know it was brilliant, but unrepeatable? No show is unrepeatable. When I get the money together, I’m going to buy the rights to it and show every episode here in this cinema. That’ll show them. The bastards. (The phone rings) Excuse me a minute. (Walks off)

Nicky:
He says bastard a lot for a Christian person.

Will:
You make an allowance for bad language in Mick’s case. He’s had a lot of problems.

Nicky:
So he said. (Pause) He didn’t give me my fiver back.

Will:
I know, look, I’ll give you a fiver when I get change. Sorry, he’s high maintenance sometimes.

Nicky:
Yeah. He looked offended when I said I’ve never heard of his programme.

Will:
It was only shown in select parts of Scotland. He’s very touchy about it.

Nicky:
Oh I agree with you on that respect. (Nicky smoothes his jacket cuff with the other hand) You know I’m not keen on people hugging me, especially complete strangers.

Will:
He isn’t exactly a complete stranger, is he, though? He’s Mick Malone.

Nicky:
So it would seem. Can we leave soon? I don’t think I want to meet the other inmates.

Will:
Look, I work with these people. Try and be a bit more respectful. You could try by losing that snooty look from your face.

Nicky:
I don’t have a snooty look.

Will:
Yes you do. You're face is contorted like you're trying to keep a sneeze in. (Mick approaches)

Mick:
Sorry about that guys, that was just somebody looking for the opening hours...of Debenhams. Wrong number. So what is it you do with yourself, Nicky?

Nicky:
I‘m at uni in Oxford doing Media Studies.

Mick:
Really? I used to live in Oxford. Beautiful city, isn’t it? Lovely old buildings. Some nice pubs as well. Have you been in The Chequers?

Nicky:
The Cheq-

Mick:
What about The Duke? The Hobgoblin? The Cock and Camel?

Nicky:
I think I might have…

Mick:
Course they might not be there any more. I bankrupted at least one of them. (Nicky laughs awkwardly but Mick and Will don’t) I lived in Oxford for six months and then I was asked to leave.

Nicky:
Who by, your landlord?

Mick:
No, the entire city. The MP got a petition together and I was politely asked to leave. Gave me a police escort and everything. I felt like royalty, until some woman in the street spat on me and called me scum.

Nicky:
What did you do that was so bad an entire metropolis asked you to leave? ?

Mick:
My dad used to be the lord mayor, and when he retired, he was given the key to the city. When he died, the key was handed down to me, but…ah, the fame sort of went to my head…

CUT TO: BAR
(We see Mick entering a crowded bar holding under one arm a giant golden key. Everyone turns to look)

Mick:
The drinks are on me!

(Everybody in the bar cheers and crowds around the bar. We see Mick plant a kiss on the key).

CUT TO: RESTAURANT

(Mick is seated at a table with two or three very attractive women; a waiter approaches the table carrying a silver tray).

Waiter:
The bill, sir. And how would sir like to pay?

(Mick takes his key out from under the table)

Mick:
With the greatest currency of them all, my good man. And that goes for everyone here too!

(All the people in the restaurant cheer and the waiter has a strained smile on his face).

CUT TO: SHOP EXTERIOR

We finally see Mick enter a hat boutique. There is a cheer and lots of people exit looking chuffed and wearing different hats. Mick is the last to exit and is wearing an extravagant Boy George-style hat. He kisses the key).

CUT TO: CINEMA FOYER.

(Mick looks morose)

Mick:
In a matter of weeks that key bankrupted two pubs, a restaurant and a hattery. We were the Bonnie and Clyde of Oxford.

Will:
Which was which?!

Nicky:
Did they let you keep the key?

Mick:
No, they gave it to that bastard Nelson Mandela. I mean, what’s he done to deserve it? (There is an awkward silence) See, nobody can answer that!

Nicky:
Anyway...I need to go back to Oxford before my granddad’s funeral. I have a few things to sort out, so...

Mick:
Well, your not going anywhere before I give you a tour of this cinema!

Nicky:
Oh no, that’s quite alright…

Mick:
Ah come on, it’ll take your mind off the corpse. Just let me fetch my keys from the till.

Nicky:
Did he just say ‘the corpse’?

Will:
I'm trying to think of something to justify that comment, but my mind's a blank

Mick:
So, Nicky! Did you ever go for a sup in The Bull and Finch? What about Satan's Grotto? Oh no wait, that wasn’t a pub.

CUT TO: CINEMA SCREEN

Curb isn't tightly scripted. In fact, the opposite. They improvise around a Larry David story, and use the take or combination of takes that works best.

Maybe you're thinking of the Office? That's scripted and doesn't sound it.

I could have sworn it was Curb, but I must be thinking of something else!