Quote: Pingl @ September 24 2012, 4:22 PM BSTIts not so much the hardness of writing Holby or Casualty its more the fact that they bother at all, formulaic nonsense that is only hard to write if you have been living on mars since 1901. The writers write to formula and barf it out like a nightclubber in Ibiza.
Post wasn't meant to relate to yours, you posted as I wrote!
Quote: Pingl @ September 24 2012, 4:22 PM BSTIts not so much the hardness of writing Holby or Casualty its more the fact that they bother at all, formulaic nonsense that is only hard to write if you have been living on mars since 1901. The writers write to formula and barf it out like a nightclubber in Ibiza.
Try writing a script, I gurantee you'll find it hard.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:16 PM BSTand it actually turned out to be one of the hardest things to write. I'll go with what they say.
Most of 'they' aren't even proper science fiction writers. When they did bring one on board in the form of Neil Gaiman, guess what happened? He knocked it out of the park.
The reason 'they' found it one of the hardest things to write, was because they either lacked imagination or were following some bizarre orders from Moffat. Some writers are better suited to a particular genre - like soaps - and they think they can bring the same disciplines to science fiction. It doesn't work like that.
Just like you wouldn't ask Mike Leigh to write and direct a Lethal Weapon movie.
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ September 24 2012, 4:04 PM BSTI disagree entirely, I've watched loads of sci-fi from Twilight Zone to Star Trek
I wouldn't say Star Trek does as much world building week on week, and has much more of a constant setting and large cast of characters.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:23 PM BSTPost wasn't meant to relate to yours, you posted as I wrote!
Sorry but I really hate Holby GRRRRR!
Quote: sootyj @ September 24 2012, 4:23 PM BSTTry writing a script, I gurantee you'll find it hard.
I wouldn't want to try, but I think you'll find its just a revolving door of similar storylines infanitum. I really couldn't be bothered to waste the ink, its cliche ridden nonsense.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:27 PM BSTI wouldn't say Star Trek does as much world building week on week, and has much more of a constant setting and large cast of characters.
But if you look through the history of Trek, there are loads of stand alone stories, usually when a character is trapped away from the ship. Your argument that total freedom limits writers is bogus.
You can draw upon everything that has happened, is happening or will happen throughout time and space. It saddens me that Red Dwarf has had more interesting, original and thought provoking storylines then New Who. And they made sense.
Quote: Pingl @ September 24 2012, 4:22 PM BSTIts not so much the hardness of writing Holby or Casualty its more the fact that they bother at all, formulaic nonsense that is only hard to write if you have been living on mars since 1901. The writers write to formula and barf it out like a nightclubber in Ibiza.
Yeah. This.
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ September 24 2012, 4:26 PM BSTMost of 'they' aren't even proper science fiction writers.
Neither was Moffat, but he certainly managed a few great Who stories. You don't need to be a 'proper sci-fi writer' to write great Doctor Who episodes, just a great writer.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:23 PM BSTPost wasn't meant to relate to yours, you posted as I wrote!
I think we all knew who you meant. 
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:32 PM BSTNeither was Moffat, but he certainly managed a few great Who stories. You don't need to be a 'proper sci-fi writer' to write great Doctor Who episodes, just a great writer.
He did manage some excellent ones.
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ September 24 2012, 4:31 PM BSTBut if you look through the history of Trek, there are loads of stand alone stories, usually when a character is trapped away from the ship. Your argument that total freedom limits writers is bogus.
I'm actually repeating what the writers themselves have said; it's their point of view, not mine. I wouldn't know as I haven't actually written for the show! And they haven't said it 'limited' them. And again, Trek isn't a direct enough comparison, they have, most weeks, far more returning characters and settings.
There are all kinds of reasons why working on different shows is hard, but narrative construction is no different really, that's why the word genre is used.
Quote: Marc P @ September 24 2012, 4:36 PM BSTThere are all kinds of reasons why working on different shows is hard, but narrative construction is no different really, that's why the word genre is used.
I think construction from genre to genre has varying degrees of hardness, comic dialogue is much harder than say the overwrought structure of a medical drama. With Sci Fi I wouldn't know where to start, but some genres have a formula and people stick to them.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:27 PM BSTI wouldn't say Star Trek does as much world building week on week, and has much more of a constant setting and large cast of characters.
Quite. Star Trek had the central set up of the Enterprise and its crew. The Twilight Zone relied on small twists of recognisable reality.
Who is unique in that there is, or rather should not be, any carry over from week to week, so each storyline has to establish a new reality and draw the viewer into a narrative that stands or fall on its own merits.
WRONG!!!!
The formula is the same. A bunch of sailors in a boat land on differing islands each week and each week face the monsters on said island.
One boat is the HMS TARDIS the other the USS Enterprise.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2012, 4:32 PM BSTNeither was Moffat, but he certainly managed a few great Who stories. You don't need to be a 'proper sci-fi writer' to write great Doctor Who episodes, just a great writer.
With an emphasis on the few. I think if you want to compare Doctor Who to any other sci-fi show, then Quantum Leap seems to be the most similar. Every week was a new situation, a new set of characters, a new setting in time and a central character that brought about resolutions.
Based on some of the episodes of New Who, where wishing things better or waving the magic screwdriver makes everything good again, writing it would be a piece of piss.
EDIT: Almost forgot about Sliders, which also had lots of groovy alternate histories and brand new worlds.