Graham Linehan Page 2

Quote: Sitcomfan64 @ 26th March 2022, 5:57 PM

The man isn't well. He literally just needed to keep his mouth shut. That's it. Now he's lost his marriage and career. My sympathy goes out to his wife and children for the unimaginable stress and strain he put them under.

It's one thing to have an opinion on an issue. It's quite another to devote your entire life to a campaign that frankly shouldn't concern him.

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I still don't know what he's done wrong. Why does everyone have to bow down to ridiculous minorities and I don't mean Trans people. Really what some of these idiots want is hrmful to genuine trans people.

You can disagree with people - but you don't have to rant and scream at them and give your whole life over to hounding them - to the point your family decide you're too much of a liability and leave you. The solution to these things is reasoned argument peppered with a liberal amount of empathy. There are nutters on both sides of the argument. He is one of them.

Quote: Lazzard @ 2nd April 2022, 6:53 PM

You can disagree with people - but you don't have to rant and scream at them and give your whole life over to hounding them - to the point your family decide you're too much of a liability and leave you. The solution to these things is reasoned argument peppered with a liberal amount of empathy. There are nutters on both sides of the argument. He is one of them.

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He's not a nutter. How can you have someone with a penis wandering around a woman's swimming changing room?

Well, you could ask that question politely - listen to the answer and then reply with another question.
Or you could scream about it on Twitter, insulting all and sundry.
Like a nutter.

A certain percentage of any bunch of people are arseholes. People need to stop judging groups by their arseholes. Some trans activists are arses. Some anti-trans people are arses. I disagree with Linehan, a lot, and think he's going about stuff in a particularly dickish way, but some of the behaviour towards him is totally unacceptable.

Quote: Chappers @ 2nd April 2022, 6:59 PM

He's not a nutter. How can you have someone with a penis wandering around a woman's swimming changing room?

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My impression is that, had Linehan in fact been a trans ally rather than trans sceptic, the outcomes would have been the same. What we see is the result of his obsession rather than of his opinion.

Quote: gappy @ 4th April 2022, 9:23 AM

What we see is the result of his obsession rather than of his opinion.

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In a nutshell.

To all men who have daughters. Do you want a woman with a penis (lol) stripping off in women's changing rooms flashing her tackle at them.
Or is it ok because she's a real woman?
Where has common sense gone? LIve your life as you see fit but don't abuse it as many do and outrage public decency.
Because that's what it is. A few probably mental cases want to do this and it's not right whatever anyone says.

And then there's the question of women's sport.

Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 4th April 2022, 10:16 AM

Where has common sense gone? LIve your life as you see fit but don't abuse it as many do and outrage public decency.

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Many?
How many?
A Google search for "Transexual exposes themselves" comes up with three pages - of the same case in LA.
And several of those are about it being untrue.
The problem is is a tricky one but, in the main, hypothetical - so it needs rational discussion.
Calling people mental cases doesn't exactly help.

Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 4th April 2022, 10:16 AM

To all men who have daughters. Do you want a woman with a penis (lol) stripping off in women's changing rooms flashing her tackle at them.
Or is it ok because she's a real woman?
Where has common sense gone? LIve your life as you see fit but don't abuse it as many do and outrage public decency.
Because that's what it is. A few probably mental cases want to do this and it's not right whatever anyone says.

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You bring up an interesting point, in mentioning common sense, because discussions of trans people allows us to rethink our assumptions. So, ignoring the fact that it is convention, what specificaly is the issue is of someone's daughter seeing someone else's genitalia, of any sort, in a non-sexual environment? I'm not saying I'll argue with whatever you come up with, but I think the asnwer can't be "but it's obvious". It's periodically useful to actually confirm why we have social conventions and mores, and that they still make sense to us.

I also don't think it's useful to discuss the "mental cases" who want to expose themselves for sexual gratification. You can't build your social rules on the basis of what a small number of transgressors might do - the very fact that sexual exposure/harassment is already a criminal matter for cis-gendered people tells you this (ie, if I came up to you - or your young son - in the male changing room with a hard-on, or waving my dick in your face, you'd be able to call the police and get me arrested...or give me a punch up the backet, according to taste).

I don't have strong opinions on changing rooms, incidentally, and we may end up agreeing, but I'm just saying that in order to reach a final policy we as a society will need to go beyond "common sense" and "public decency" because I don't really believe those phrases have much concrete meaning.

cis-gender/ who the f**k made that word up?
Is that supposed label me as something else?

That is the problem right there, Everyone is supposed to bend to a few confused people. I'm cis f**k all.

What actually happens is that trans women who still have a penis use pools with individual cubicles and there's no problem.

Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 4th April 2022, 1:58 PM

cis-gender/ who the f**k made that word up?
Is that supposed label me as something else?

That is the problem right there, Everyone is supposed to bend to a few confused people. I'm cis f**k all.

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Yay, go Team Common Sense!

Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 4th April 2022, 1:58 PM

cis-gender/ who the f**k made that word up?
Is that supposed label me as something else?

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It is newspeak for 'normal'. I.e. you are biologically the same as how you 'feel'.