I'm not linking the two, I'm saying certain (extreme) subjects shouldn't be joked about (even if they are funny) as the gullible idiots you talk about exist (unfortunately) and its best we don't light their fuses as they seem have more effect on our daily lives than we do.
Quote: ContainsNuts @ November 30, 2007, 3:09 PMI'm not linking the two, I'm saying certain (extreme) subjects shouldn't be joked about (even if they are funny) as the gullible idiots you talk about exist (unfortunately) and its best we don't light their fuses as they seem have more effect on our daily lives than we do.
What you appear to be saying is that YOU think certain subjects shouldn't be joked about. And because YOU think that then YOU'VE decided others shouldn't joke about them either. That has got to be wrong, surely?
The gullible idiots to whom you refer are as just as much entitled to their point of view as you are. I would say that the 'Politically Correct' have a greater and more damaging effect on our daily lives than the 'idiots' do. The 'idiots' don't know any better by their nature and mostly don't have any real power. The 'Politically Correct' ought to (and often do have power) and I despise them the greater because of that.
Ironically, the 'Politically Correct' are actually preventing society from dealing with the 'idiots' effectively and are slowly destroying our society in the process.
Quote: Frankie Rage @ November 30, 2007, 10:53 PMWhat you appear to be saying is that YOU think certain subjects shouldn't be joked about. And because YOU think that then YOU'VE decided others shouldn't joke about them either. That has got to be wrong, surely?
Yes that is wrong, because that's not what I meant. I've not decided anything, but we've all been taught what we should and shouldn't joke about. I'm talking about extreme jokes (racist etc) that might be 'funny' in construction but not acceptable for the public as quite most will look at the construction of the joke just the meaning.
Or are you saying racist jokes are acceptable? Then that's a whole different topic that I'm not getting into.
All subjects are open to comedy in my opinion, especially taboo subjects.
At the moment, we are too scared to rip the piss out of islam and yet christianity gets a ruff time and rightly so.
Fear should not stop us from pointing out the hypocrosy(Sp! Sorry) of beliefs and dogma.
Look at what is happening in Sudan over the name of a teddy bear. Talk about getting a sense of humour!
- I am quite pissed so sorry about spelling and grammer etc aaron.
Quote: ContainsNuts @ November 30, 2007, 11:58 PMYes that is wrong, because that's not what I meant. I've not decided anything, but we've all been taught what we should and shouldn't joke about. I'm talking about extreme jokes (racist etc) that might be 'funny' in construction but not acceptable for the public as quite most will look at the construction of the joke just the meaning.
Or are you saying racist jokes are acceptable? Then that's a whole different topic that I'm not getting into.
Btw who have we been taught by?
I am suggesting that it's up to the individual as to what is acceptable and what isn't (within the law).
I am not saying that racist jokes are acceptable or unacceptable. I don't think the question as to whether they are or not needs to be asked or answered. Individuals should decide that in their own contexts. That's freedom of speech and if people do stray too far we have liable law, slander law and 'incitement to hatred' law to deal with it in the courts!
A joke about some one who is different is acceptable. One that incites hatred is not. The line has been blurred in the last 15 years.
If that stamps out racism then its a good thing but i doubt it will.
Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 12:09 AMBtw who have we been taught by?
I am suggesting that it's up to the individual as to what is acceptable and what isn't (within the law).
I am not saying that racist jokes are acceptable or unacceptable.
I don't think the question as to whether they are or not needs to be asked or answered. Individuals should decide that in their own contexts. That's freedom of speech and if people do stray too far we have liable law, slander law and 'incitement to hatred' law to deal with it in the courts!
Frankie, lets not get into this. I haven't written a knob gag for five posts now and I'm getting a bit restless. I completely disagree with your argument and you completely disagree with mine. There's freedom of speech and thought at its best!
It would such a long debate and we probably wouldn't get anywhere. Millions haven't before us. We both accept freedom of speech but to different levels. The end.
It doesn't matter if you don't get my point. That's the wife's job. Hurrah! 
Quote: jacparov @ December 1, 2007, 12:14 AMA joke about some one who is different is acceptable. One that incites hatred is not. The line has been blurred in the last 15 years.
If that stamps out racism then its a good thing but i doubt it will.
Racism is deep rooted in human nature and will take a long time to eradicate (if ever). Hopefully, the new 'incitement to hatred' law will deal with any comedian or anybody else who tries to incite hatred. And if the law doesn't deal with it, then it's not hatred. You can't have it both ways.
I don't think it is racism per se just fear of the different, and that is certainly deep rooted.
And you can have it both ways because the law is an ass!
Quote: ContainsNuts @ December 1, 2007, 12:22 AMFrankie, lets not get into this. I haven't written a knob gag for five posts now and I'm getting a bit restless. I completely disagree with your argument and you completely disagree with mine. There's freedom of speech and thought at its best!
It would such a long debate and we probably wouldn't get anywhere. Millions haven't before us. We both accept freedom of speech but to different levels. The end.
It doesn't matter if you don't get my point. That's the wife's job. Hurrah!
So what are saying, that you can tell knob gags better than me? You can't even spell nob!
Quote: Frankie Rage @ November 30, 2007, 10:53 PMIronically, the 'Politically Correct' are actually preventing society from dealing with the 'idiots' effectively and are slowly destroying our society in the process.
That's such an ludicrous overstatement that it makes the most hyperventilating advocate of political correctness look positively apathetic. Political correctness was effectively instigated at a very important time in the 70s, where the NF was gaining widespread support and the television was full of such cheery chappies as Bernard Manning, Jim Davidson and The Black And White Minstrels. Immigration was a hotly debated topic and at the time such 'light entertainers' were only providing fuel for misinformed prejudice of the British public. Political correctness was resisted back then - in the words of Stewart Lee, 'God, wasn't it awful having to be fair to people' - but society's attitudes towards minorities notably shifted. Political correctness inestimably formed the multicultural society that we live in today.
The problem now is that people imagine that to be politically correct is to avoid offending anybody. This is not the case, and it's explicit definition is, 'the avoidance of expressions or actions that can be perceived to exclude or marginalize people who are socially disadvantaged or discriminated against'. That is why jokes about women were seen as antagonising in a discriminatory society, and that was why homophobic jokes were attacked in a discriminatory society. Noone - to my knowledge - has been arrested for making a 'non-pc' joke, but many have been disregarded by an evolving society. Besides which, has anybody noticed that the non-pc comedians are always moronic, witless, clunking and banal?
Cinnamon - I like your last sentence. True and funny.
Quote: jacparov @ December 1, 2007, 12:24 AMI don't think it is racism per se just fear of the different, and that is certainly deep rooted.
And you can have it both ways because the law is an ass!
People being perceived as different is often because they are from a different race. If you think about it, it's quite normal to fear something different (at least initially). It's a survival mechanism from when we lived in isolation. In those days fear of 'strangers' was quite wise - they had often come to f**k you! The World has become so much smaller, and so fast that our natural defence mechanisms have gone haywire! Often the simple truth also is that people just don't like other people who are different to them and thats because of small mindedness, selfishness, lack of intelligence and/or poor education.
The law is an ass, but I'll settle for it. If someone is charged with 'incitement to hatred' and a court finds them 'not guilty', then they are not guilty and vicky verka!
I agree, it's basically what i meant but i am too pissed to say as elegantly as you.
Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 12:25 AMSo what are saying, that you can tell knob gags better than me? You can't even spell nob!
I spelt it like that on purpose to make my 'nob' bigger than yours!
