Quote: A Horseradish @ 16th November 2019, 12:43 PM"it has got something" sums up my life.
I have before me a letter from a prominent TV production company saying "We here are all agreed that you've got something. We are similarly agreed that we don't want it."
Bastards! 
Quote: Rood Eye @ 16th November 2019, 2:46 PMI have before me a letter from a prominent TV production company saying "We here are all agreed that you've got something. We are similarly agreed that we don't want it."
Bastards!
Does it matter? You entertain us. This is a true story. I hope people can see where I do a true story and where I attempt a sketch, I was in a student house for a year, We could get bored. We tried to entertain ourselves. It started with us sitting at a table and aimlessly moving salt and pepper pots and sachets of sauce around. And over time we kind of developed it. We called each bit of it by a well known name. There was Princess Anne, Fatima Whitbread and the Pope. A lot of others. Somehow within weeks it had turned into an actual game with a few basic rules although it was all very anarchic.
I'm kind of thinking almost The Young Ones which did coincide. Loads of rows and punch ups until people found a way through, unlike now where nobody ever compromises. And in the mayhem it got more and more complicated and more stupid until someone said something like "you would need to be Boris Spassky to get to the level where John Paul screws the Princess Royal". At which point everyone did the proverbial "wow". It was genuinely a huge light sabre moment.
A hey, this is the most trite yet complicated and serious game that has ever been invented. Let's turn it into an amateur looking board game and forward it to Waddingtons. We did it. Our covering letter described the concept - "Totally complex, totally trite, never been done before : obviously you might not want in the product you produce the Pope and Anne per se but it would be along those lines : you are in Yorkshire, we are too, let's have an interview". They did reply. It was a one liner. "All of our games are designed in-house". Our view was that while we had liked them we didn't care now if they went bust and we just went off to the pub. Who still has those rules? Secretly me. They didn't know I kept them!,
Quote: A Horseradish @ 16th November 2019, 3:12 PMYou entertain us.
I've printed that out and stuck it to the top of my monitor. 
Thanks, Horse! 
I've been constructing a Facebook quiz on knowledge about the EU.
It says you can post the link on other websites too, so I'm going to give it a go here too.
It is anonymous. Click the link to answer the quiz
How much do you know about EU Government? https://qz.app.do/intial-test-quiz
Hmm It's not quite right, I can't seem to remove the effect of two dummy questions I put in as first try, so it starts by thinking I have done 8% of the questions.
Your mileage may vary.
I got two wrong but it doesn't tell me which ones?
Quote: Lazzard @ 8th December 2019, 11:11 AMI got two wrong but it doesn't tell me which ones?
Yes I deliberately didn't publish the correct answers yet. The information is readily available out there on the Internet in documents/pages that have not been blacked out. I will probably publish the correct answers with links after the quiz closes.
I suspect a substantial number of "leave" voters are young or vegan or both - and thus have significantly less than average need for food and/or medicines.
Vegans tend to need more medication than the average.
I had 43 participants in this quiz, but only 39 of those answered any questions and only 30 completed all the questions. Truly a rather small sample. Only two participants responded via the Facebook posting, the posting of the link on 3 other forums and emails to some friends including the link were far more effective.
The average score was only 67% correct, so clearly there are great gaps in knowledge about the EU, which I personally find appalling considering the importance of the Leave/Remain Brexit matter. I would have hoped that our population would get around 90% on their knowledge about the EU before voting in a referendum on this.
No-one got all 13 questions right.
Anyway here are the answers
1. There are 28 member states in the EU including the UK
3 out of 35 managed to get this wrong, considering how many times this has been mentioned in the media, I have to assume they were joking or their fingers slipped on this first question.
The definitive answer to this question and questions 2 and 3 will be found on this page, count them: https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/countries_en
2. Norway is a member state of the EU
3 out of 34 got this wrong
3. Slovenia is a member state of the EU.
9 out of 34 got this wrong
4. There are 751 Members of the EU Parliament
9 out of 34 got this wrong
The definitive answer can be found here:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/faq/12/how-many-meps
5. The UK currently has 73 seats in the EU Parliament
7 out of 34 got this wrong
A definitive answer to questions 5, 6 can be found here:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/faq/12/how-many-meps
6. If Brexit occurs there will be 678 seats in the EU Parliament
9 out of 33 participants got this wrong
7. The 751 seats in the EU parliament includes the President.
20 of 32 participants got this wrong, but possibly there was
some confusion about "which" President as the EU has more
than one. I meant the President of the EU Parliament,
but didn't specifically say that.
An answer to the question can be found on Wikipedia,
which is a source that can't be regarded as totally
definitive, but is usually right:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apportionment_in_the_European_Parliament
8. Only the EU commission can initiate the creation of new EU Laws.
6 of the 30 participants got this wrong, but the words
"initiate" and "creation" are not rigourously defined so
it could be interpreted in a manner that I had not intended.
The facts as I understand it are that MEPs cannot draft a
new law for discussion in EU Parliament i.e. there is no
"Members Bill" procedure. An MEP must go to the EU Commission
and request that a bill is drafted an then submitted to
EU Parliament and Council for discussion and voting.
A definitive description of how EU laws are created can be found here:
https://europa.eu/european-union/eu-law/decision-making/procedures_en
9. The EU council consists of the Heads of State or
Prime Ministers of the Member States
16 of the 30 answers said this is not true and strictly
speaking that is correct because not all states have a
"Head of State" or "Prime minister" other titles might be
in use. Plus the President of the EU Commission, who is
not a head of state or head of government, is also a
member of the EU Council.
The composition of the council is defined here:
https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies/european-council_en
10. The President of the EU commission can be elected by a vote as
close as 50.0% to 49.9%.
6 of the 30 participants got this wrong. The election (or approval)
of the choice(s) of the EU council requires an absolute majority of
half the MEPs plus 1. Do the arithmetic with 750 MEPs, omitting
the President of the EU Parliament and you get the percentages
in the question.
You can find more information on the selection of the President of
the EU commission on these pages:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/hearings2019/commission-president-2019
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
11. European political parties are federations of national political
parties sharing a political affiliation. and are distinct
from political groups of the EU Parliament.
14 of the 30 participants for this question thought it to be
false, but it is a direct quote from the page linked below.
It would seem that the EU Political parties have an important
role in selecting candidates for the post of President of
the EU Council, but once all the roles are sorted out,
the political groups of the EU parliament are the more
important factor.
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
12. In 2014, the UK representative on the EU Council voted in favour
of Jean-Claude Juncker as the candidate for President of
the EU Commission.
18 of the 30 participants for this question got it wrong.
The answer is mentioned on page 5 of this:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
and here is an interesting article by the Guardian which may well be biased: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/27/eu-democratic-bandwagon-juncker-president-wanted
13. The UK voters turnout for the 2019 EU elections was 37% The
turnout of voters for the 2016 EU referendum was nearly
twice as much: 71.8%
6 of the 30 participants said it was false and 24 said it was true.
They are sort of both right as the first figure 37% is correct,
but the second figure should be 72.2% {I appear to have looked at
a less definitive web page when I composed the question}.
The figures can be found on:
https://europarl.europa.eu/election-results-2019/en/turnout/
Note that this forum sofware doesn't seem to get the link correct on the long PDF one, you have to add the stuff from (2018) yourself.
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
Quote: billwill @ 11th December 2019, 4:24 PMI had 43 participants in this quiz, but only 39 of those answered any questions and only 30 completed all the questions. Truly a rather small sample. Only two participants responded via the Facebook posting, the posting of the link on 3 other forums and emails to some friends including the link were far more effective.
The average score was only 67% correct, so clearly there are great gaps in knowledge about the EU, which I personally find appalling considering the importance of the Leave/Remain Brexit matter. I would have hoped that our population would get around 90% on their knowledge about the EU before voting in a referendum on this.
No-one got all 13 questions right.
Anyway here are the answers
1. There are 28 member states in the EU including the UK
3 out of 35 managed to get this wrong, considering how many times this has been mentioned in the media, I have to assume they were joking or their fingers slipped on this first question.The definitive answer to this question and questions 2 and 3 will be found on this page, count them: https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/countries_en
2. Norway is a member state of the EU
3 out of 34 got this wrong3. Slovenia is a member state of the EU.
9 out of 34 got this wrong4. There are 751 Members of the EU Parliament
9 out of 34 got this wrong
The definitive answer can be found here:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/faq/12/how-many-meps5. The UK currently has 73 seats in the EU Parliament
7 out of 34 got this wrong
A definitive answer to questions 5, 6 can be found here:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/faq/12/how-many-meps6. If Brexit occurs there will be 678 seats in the EU Parliament
9 out of 33 participants got this wrong7. The 751 seats in the EU parliament includes the President.
20 of 32 participants got this wrong, but possibly there was
some confusion about "which" President as the EU has more
than one. I meant the President of the EU Parliament,
but didn't specifically say that.
An answer to the question can be found on Wikipedia,
which is a source that can't be regarded as totally
definitive, but is usually right:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apportionment_in_the_European_Parliament8. Only the EU commission can initiate the creation of new EU Laws.
6 of the 30 participants got this wrong, but the words
"initiate" and "creation" are not rigourously defined so
it could be interpreted in a manner that I had not intended.
The facts as I understand it are that MEPs cannot draft a
new law for discussion in EU Parliament i.e. there is no
"Members Bill" procedure. An MEP must go to the EU Commission
and request that a bill is drafted an then submitted to
EU Parliament and Council for discussion and voting.
A definitive description of how EU laws are created can be found here:
https://europa.eu/european-union/eu-law/decision-making/procedures_en9. The EU council consists of the Heads of State or
Prime Ministers of the Member States
16 of the 30 answers said this is not true and strictly
speaking that is correct because not all states have a
"Head of State" or "Prime minister" other titles might be
in use. Plus the President of the EU Commission, who is
not a head of state or head of government, is also a
member of the EU Council.
The composition of the council is defined here:
https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies/european-council_en10. The President of the EU commission can be elected by a vote as
close as 50.0% to 49.9%.
6 of the 30 participants got this wrong. The election (or approval)
of the choice(s) of the EU council requires an absolute majority of
half the MEPs plus 1. Do the arithmetic with 750 MEPs, omitting
the President of the EU Parliament and you get the percentages
in the question.
You can find more information on the selection of the President of
the EU commission on these pages: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/hearings2019/commission-president-2019https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
11. European political parties are federations of national political
parties sharing a political affiliation. and are distinct
from political groups of the EU Parliament.
14 of the 30 participants for this question thought it to be
false, but it is a direct quote from the page linked below.
It would seem that the EU Political parties have an important
role in selecting candidates for the post of President of
the EU Council, but once all the roles are sorted out,
the political groups of the EU parliament are the more
important factor.https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
12. In 2014, the UK representative on the EU Council voted in favour
of Jean-Claude Juncker as the candidate for President of
the EU Commission.
18 of the 30 participants for this question got it wrong.
The answer is mentioned on page 5 of this:https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/BRIE/2018/630264/EPRS_BRI(2018)630264_EN.pdf
and here is an interesting article by the Guardian which may well be biased: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/27/eu-democratic-bandwagon-juncker-president-wanted
13. The UK voters turnout for the 2019 EU elections was 37% The
turnout of voters for the 2016 EU referendum was nearly
twice as much: 71.8%
6 of the 30 participants said it was false and 24 said it was true.
They are sort of both right as the first figure 37% is correct,
but the second figure should be 72.2% {I appear to have looked at
a less definitive web page when I composed the question}.
The figures can be found on: https://europarl.europa.eu/election-results-2019/en/turnout/
So essemtially you're arguing for another referendum, billwill, because the last result was based on ignorance.
I've said it before & I'll say it again: one should never ask the Great British public anything. Boaty McBoatface indeed.
Quote: chipolata @ 11th December 2019, 5:28 PMSo essemtially you're arguing for another referendum, billwill, because the last result was based on ignorance.
Not unless the voters take a knowledge test first and also swear to abide by the majority decision.
Quote: billwill @ 11th December 2019, 7:33 PMNot unless the voters take a knowledge test first and also swear to abide by the majority decision.
Come up with a proper Brexit plan that the majority vote for and I'll abide by it. As it is we have no deal Brexit, Boris's deal Brexit, Theresa May's deal Brexit. You Brexiteers have to decide which way you think is the best way to wreck Britain and stick with it. Show some balls.
I might do that if you can come up with an accurate description/estimate of what the EU will be like and what the UK's position in the EU will be like in 15-20 years time if the UK remains in the EU.