Please, Marc! There's a time and a plaice for puns.
Catholic Child abuse scandals Page 3
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 29 2010, 9:20 AM GMTYes it just all goes to show what a complete man made nonsense religion ever was, it's a farce that's gone on far too long now. When bad things happen, churches just say 'It's the devil's doing.' Well in that case the devil has a major stake in the Catholic Church at the moment, in fact he's running it. Religion itself is the evil. The Bolsheviks, for all their vulgarity, had exactly the right idea about religion - destroy it!
The infuriating thing is all around the world Catholics fight ionjustice, teach the ignorant and heal the sick. That they are stained by the repuation of their deranged, senile, sexually misfunctioning is the truest tragedy.
I mean would you want England judged by the standard of Gordon Brown? And that c**t represents an elected party.
I agree with that to an extent, as they have done some genuine good, and a lot of their members are genuinely good, but that isn't the whole story is it. Unfortunately, as an institution, they also sought to dominate the world, to indoctrinate everyone, to invent frightening fantasies about heaven and hell in order to control everyone, to start purges and wars against many millions who didn't agree with them, to con people into giving them their wealth, to not even practise what they preach, to hold grudges against many millions whose sexual persuasion they do not like, and to dangerously promote rapid over population and sexual disease with their antedeluvian (haven't used that in ages) stance on everything. They are NUTTERS plain and simple, and dangerous ones.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 28 2010, 9:40 PM GMTThe Church of Rome has been quite embarrassed by their Irish members.
From the very first convert. 
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 29 2010, 9:20 AM GMTWhen bad things happen, churches just say 'It's the devil's doing.' Well in that case the devil has a major stake in the Catholic Church at the moment.
And you'd abolish the police force because there are bent coppers? All man-made organisations fail because they rely on people. Even a perfect organisation, if run by imperfect beings, is doomed to failure. There are no perfect organisations, so it's not sensible to expect to find any.
But in saying that, it doesn't excuse any organisation or individual from law-breaking.
Quote: Nogget @ March 29 2010, 9:24 AM GMTEven they replaced it with their own atheist religion, that of the cult of leader.
I'm wondering if the religious impulse is far more deeply rooted than the idea that it's down to culture or social upbringing. It seems we can only replace the object of our worship, rather than simply replace the primal need to worship.
Quote: sootyj @ March 28 2010, 8:16 PM GMTAbsolutely true. The Catholic Church probably does more to feed, teach and fight injustic then any other faith organisation.
But does it's beureacratic structure make it culpable in the bahviour of some of it's members?
Do vows of celibacy encourage sexually disfunctionality?
I think so. Priests are not allowed to have sex, they don't experience intimacy and are not allowed to masturbate either. Tug-free from puberty to death is a priest's lot. I'm sure they experience nocturnal emissions.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 29 2010, 11:11 AM GMTUnfortunately, as an institution, they also sought to dominate the world, to indoctrinate everyone, to invent frightening fantasies about heaven and hell in order to control everyone, to start purges and wars against many millions who didn't agree with them
But this is in the nature of all humans. We all seek power, few of us could turn down the opportunity to be king of the world for a day. We like people to agree with our views because our world-view is the only right and sensible one; why else do we argue when someone contradicts our notion of the world, be it political, economic, or what's in Chat magazine?
All of us invent fantasies to keep others in line (the Evil communists v The freedom of the West, the vile Capitalists v the Communist utopia, Father Christmas, boogey monsters, etc). Purges and wars would still be raging in a world free from religion - probably the greatest purges in all history were within the enlightened civilised atheistic nations of recent history. Few wars were ever fundamentally religious - they're more to do with resources and power.
Quote: Nigel Kelly @ March 29 2010, 11:50 AM GMTTug-free from puberty to death is a priest's lot. I'm sure they experience nocturnal emissions.
Or it could explain the need for such large cassocks?
Quote: SlagA @ March 29 2010, 11:57 AM GMTBut this is in the nature of all humans. We all seek power, few of us could turn down the opportunity to be king of the world for a day. We like people to agree with our views because our world-view is the only right and sensible one; why else do we argue when someone contradicts our notion of the world, be it political, economic, or what's in Chat magazine?
All of us invent fantasies to keep others in line (the Evil communists v The freedom of the West, the vile Capitalists v the Communist utopia, Father Christmas, boogey monsters, etc). Purges and wars would still be raging in a world free from religion - probably the greatest purges in all history were within the enlightened civilised atheistic nations of recent history. Few wars were ever fundamentally religious - they're more to do with resources and power.
I totally agree with you, in a way what you are confirming is that religion was a human fabrication, to allow humans to do what humans like doing. But I'm afraid the head of the Catholic Church who says he is God's representative on Earth, will not agree with this view - this is where the major problem is - the institution itself is based on an almighty delusion.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 29 2010, 12:07 PM GMTI totally agree with you, in a way what you are confirming is that religion was a human fabrication
No, what I'm saying is imperfect people can't attain perfection.
But, I think, you're saying that the only way a religion could demonstrate it was divine in origin is if it was followed perfectly by its adherents. Your test will produce the answer you expect and want.
Quote: bigfella @ March 28 2010, 8:11 PM GMTIndiviuals must taken responsibility for their own actions.
Care to write that down and send it to the Labour Party?
And yes, the Catholic church is pretty abhorrent.
Quote: SlagA @ March 29 2010, 11:57 AM GMTBut this is in the nature of all humans. We all seek power, few of us could turn down the opportunity to be king of the world for a day. We like people to agree with our views because our world-view is the only right and sensible one; why else do we argue when someone contradicts our notion of the world, be it political, economic, or what's in Chat magazine?
All of us invent fantasies to keep others in line (the Evil communists v The freedom of the West, the vile Capitalists v the Communist utopia, Father Christmas, boogey monsters, etc). Purges and wars would still be raging in a world free from religion - probably the greatest purges in all history were within the enlightened civilised atheistic nations of recent history. Few wars were ever fundamentally religious - they're more to do with resources and power.
Yes on all counts.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ March 29 2010, 12:07 PM GMTI totally agree with you, in a way what you are confirming is that religion was a human fabrication, to allow humans to do what humans like doing. But I'm afraid the head of the Catholic Church who says he is God's representative on Earth, will not agree with this view - this is where the major problem is - the institution itself is based on an almighty delusion.
But not a conspiracy, and not one that can be destroyed. People will believe in what they want to believe and there's no harm in them doing so. Religions only become dangerous in the case of fundamentalism and exremism. But all ideologies become dangerous then.
And yes, religion is a human fabrication. But so is politics, art, ethics...our attitudes to all ideologies change (what is morally right now is not the same as what was morally right 100 years ago - there is no definite truth to anything man-made.) Religion acts the same way. Christians (the majority of them) change their beliefs with the times by using their own minds. Unfortunately, the "it is not for us to question why" image of the church is the one that is publicised the most.
Why do people need religion?
Quote: Oldrocker @ March 30 2010, 1:11 AM GMTWhy do people need religion?
God only knows.