Here's a link to a really great post by M.A.S.H./Cheers/Frasier writer Ken Levine.
http://kenlevine.blogspot.com/2009/07/writing-tip-beating-jokes.html
Writing tip: Beating jokes
Write funnier jokes. Good advice.
You make a very good point.
But what I liked about the post was to think in terms of how far we can push a gag. When so many of us are writing topical material at the moment (and probably covering the same stories) this is probably the difference between success and failure.
Fair enough, a good point when it comes to topical stuff.
I would imagine most of us run through scripts over and over again to try and improve each gag. The difference between funny and very funny can be as little as one word change. The good point to be made here is not to trust your first instincts when writing comedy. Especially in sitcom, lines which get written in early rough drafts tend to garner more emotional attachment from a writer, even if by draft 5,6,7+ they are objectively the weak links. Writers seem to hold onto theses jokes rather preciously as their "bankers", their core jokes. Always be looking for a better joke and always be willing to axe a joke for the greater good.
Quote: Tim Walker @ July 7 2009, 6:08 AM BSTI would imagine most of us run through scripts over and over again to try and improve each gag. The difference between funny and very funny can be as little as one word change. The good point to be made here is not to trust your first instincts when writing comedy. Especially in sitcom, lines which get written in early rough drafts tend to garner more emotional attachment from a writer, even if by draft 5,6,7+ they are objectively the weak links. Writers seem to hold onto theses jokes rather preciously as their "bankers", their core jokes. Always be looking for a better joke and always be willing to axe a joke for the greater good.
Very good advice there Tim.
I often axe jokes from my scripts if they're not working with the characters or situation.
Don't know what people are worrried about. Just coz it's axed, it doesn't mean it's gone. I enter them into a word doc and save them for a future script.
This is apparently one of the reasons American comedies have such a high joke rate. Writers trying to top each others jokes, so you can get several jokes in a row, each going a bit further.
Quote: ShoePie @ July 7 2009, 11:59 AM BSTThis is apparently one of the reasons American comedies have such a high joke rate. Writers trying to top each others jokes, so you can get several jokes in a row, each going a bit further.
But also the reason why their characterisations can become weak and interchangeable and shows can lack pathos. (On the very best American comedies there's a writer employed solely to represent each main character; to protect that character's identity from being compromised by a roomful or writers just trying for the funniest lines. On Frasier, for example, there were four writers who's sole job was to represent the interests of Frasier/Niles/Dad/Daphne respectively.)
Quote: Tim Walker @ July 7 2009, 12:03 PM BSTOn Frasier, for example, there were four writers who's sole job was to represent the interests of Frasier/Niles/Dad/Daphne respectively.)
And what a good job they did. My favourite Americom by a distance.
Quote: T.W. @ 7th July 2009, 4:03 PM BSTBut also the reason why their characterisations can become weak and interchangeable and shows can lack pathos. (On the very best American comedies there's a writer employed solely to represent each main character; to protect that character's identity from being compromised by a roomful or writers just trying for the funniest lines. On Frasier, for example, there were four writers who's sole job was to represent the interests of Frasier/Niles/Dad/Daphne respectively.)
I'm pretty sure they did the same thing with 2 Pints of Lager
Having just read the article the funny thing is the first commentator kicks the shit out of the authors joke