Yes, take your point.
But if the half arsed petition goes on, what sanctions does it propose for the non benefit scroungers?
As I say, not thought through,
I read the news today oh boy! Page 478
Don't get me wrong Rocker, I think the petition is stupid, but I think pretty much all petitions are stupid. I'm thinking of starting one to support the abolition of this crazy illusion of democracy in action.
Quote: Oldrocker @ August 12 2011, 1:01 AM BSTYes, take your point.
But if the half arsed petition goes on, what sanctions does it propose for the non benefit scroungers?
As I say, not thought through,
It's a hopeless situation. But they should not recieve a penny housing benefit or jobseekers allowance because many people, in fact thousands and thousands, who haven't looted or smashed up buildings have jsa sanctions everyday for missing appointments or getting fired or breaking their agreement in some small way.
People on sickness have recently had to score points in a corrupt test aimed at halving the number of claimants. So someone convicted of a crime against their community, in such a cowardly and piss-taking way, should at the very least have their lives inconvenienced financially.
Whatever you do, don't make them perform community service or they'll get hit by lightning and acquire superpowers. (By the way, when does the next series of Misfits air?)
Well, if you withdraw benefits where will they get money to survive?...
very shortsited, will cause more malcontent surely?
Quote: Timbo @ August 12 2011, 12:35 AM BSTThey will be once they lose their jobs as a result of being sent to prison and on release find themselves unemployable because of their criminal record.
Absolutely. It's as if those in charge actually want to create an underclass.
I notice they have made no attempt to debate the causes of these problems, but have simply leapt to the conclusion that tough sentencing will solve everything. Yet quite recently we heard that prisons were full to bursting, and truly nasty criminals were being released early.
If we lock up all the Lidl-looters, how many kiddy-fiddlers will have to be released?
Quote: Timbo @ August 12 2011, 12:21 AM BSTAre a lot of crimes committed on one night really worse for a society than the everyday lawlessness that drains hope from our cities 365 days a year?
I'd like to if there was actually any more crime of that sort overall, in that period, than there usually is.
Quote: Nogget @ August 12 2011, 6:51 AM BSTAbsolutely. It's as if those in charge actually want to create an underclass.
You're right. We should let them off without any punishment whatsoever. This notion of making people pay for their crimes is crazy.
Quote: chipolata @ August 12 2011, 9:47 AM BSTYou're right. We should let them off without any punishment whatsoever. This notion of making people pay for their crimes is crazy.
Quote: Nogget @ August 11 2011, 4:57 PM BSTI understand the need to punish these rioters
Well done, Noggsy. For a moment I had you pegged as a bleeding heart liberal too busy fretting over people that had no need to riot at all, but just chose to for some thrill or exagerated chip on their shoulders. 
Quote: chipolata @ August 12 2011, 9:47 AM BSTYou're right. We should let them off without any punishment whatsoever. This notion of making people pay for their crimes is crazy.
Yes Chip, because that's what everyone is saying. No, really, it must be, because that's what you've posted.
Bring back Chiip!
Good lord, the telegraph prints something that resembles insight
Crime is crime is crime is crime
I don't care why you looted a shop, through a brick at a copper or set fire to something. It's a crime there are laws you should be arrested, tried and if found guilty punished.
And if that screws up your career plans tough.
As for council housing, there are usually rules around tenancies covering acceptable behaviour. If you break them you should be evicted, though most likely rehoused.
There should be no special exemptions.
I tend to be suspicious of anyone as professionally self-righteous as Peter Oborne, but that is a very valid piece of comment.
I have started doing the Telegraph Crossword - it can be quite tricky.
Quote: Timbo @ August 12 2011, 11:08 AM BSTI tend to be suspicious of anyone as professionally self-righteous as Peter Oborne, but that is a very valid piece of comment.
Quite.
There is no justification for the actions of rioters and looters, but if you're consistently told f**k you by those at the top, supposedly representing the mores of society, then it's not surprising if 'society' gets told f**k you back.
While each of the individuals involved must be held responsible for their own actions, this still doesn't solve the problem of this happening again in future, along with other aspects of day to day crime and lack of shared morals. What can be done at the core of society that there aren't any, or many, people who think and feel like this?
I love a bit of retribution and am particularly fond of knee jerk reactions, but if people lose their housing then they won't cease to exist and their attitudes won't be improved. There must be longer term solutions..