Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 3:17 PM BSTI'll bet that guy's congregation numbers in the tens of people. I doubt any gays are part of it
Yeah, they've probably clubbed together and killed all of them.
I read the news today oh boy! Page 1,825
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 2:01 PM BSTI don't think you'll find that American cops "merrily" gun people down, they shoot when their lives, or the lives of others, are in danger. And I don't think you'd find any armed cop in Holland, Japan, the UK or anywhere else who wouldn't do the same.
No but from Waco to the guy with a walkman who got shot in the back, the
"I thought he had a gun excuse"
Pushes your death by cop stats to the point of a Schwarzenegger movie.
In Japan with a population of 100,000,000 and a fully armed police force, the last time the cops shot anyone was at least a decade ago.
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 3:17 PM BSTHate speech laws are a stupid thing and an extremely slippery slope. Imagine President Obama being arrested for applauding the killing of Osama bin Laden...
I'll bet that guy's congregation numbers in the tens of people. I doubt any gays are part of it and it's certainly not indicative of the sentiment in Sacramento as a whole.
That would work if hate speech laws were written by 5 year olds.
Fortunately they're not.
Why not check out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_Kingdom
and see how things work in our, bitter, post 1984 Socialist hell hole.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:08 PM BSTExcept in a number of cases most famously Gabrielle Giffords shooting, the gunman was tackled to the ground whilst reloading.
You can keep making your point, I'll just keep pointing out you're wrong.
How much experience and training do you have with firearms? When is the last time you reloaded a gun? Sorry, but you're simply wrong.
As for the Giffords shooting, he still managed to shoot 19 people. He was also a bumbling schizophrenic who dropped the new magazine that he was trying to insert and that's when someone grabbed it and he was subsequently tackled. To be clear: he wasn't tackled because he had to stop to reload, he was tackled because he carelessly dropped his magazine. Had he not done so, or had he simply carried additional magazines, he would have carried on murdering people. There was a concealed weapon holder there that day, but he arrived after the shooting stopped. In all likelihood, he would have been the one who would have stopped the shooting had numbnuts not dropped his magazine.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:16 PM BSTExactly what are you hunting that requires a semi automatic carbine in 5.56mm? Not bears it isn't powerful enough, usually deer. Are the deer in Texas especially agressive or are you just such a lousy shot you need upto 30 bullets and a one second reload?
I'm quite a good shot, thank you very much.
My rifle is excellent for hunting anything up to the size of deer, which I've done. And a semi-auto rifle is pretty much a necessity when shooting wild hogs. They tend to travel in groups of 8 or more and you'd never be able to shoot more than one if you had to use a bolt action rifle.
Quote: zooo @ 14th June 2016, 3:20 PM BSTYeah, they've probably clubbed together and killed all of them.
I haven't watched the video, but I'd assume that the only way a preacher's sermon to a small group made it onto YouTube was because a member of the congregation took offence and posted it for the world to see.
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 3:36 PM BSTHow much experience and training do you have with firearms?
As much as the killer?
I wonder if it'll turn into the same thing as IRA and carbombs. Is it to do with easy access to weapons or to do with so many people condoning revolution?
According to FBI studies an experienced gun man can reload a pistol magazine in 2 seconds.
And you can do it in 1 second and gun down 8 wild hogs charging you.
My word your local SWAT team must have a spot for you, that or you could be the next Punisher.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:27 PM BSTIn Japan with a population of 100,000,000 and a fully armed police force, the last time the cops shot anyone was at least a decade ago.
Point a gun at a Japanese cop and see what happens.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:27 PM BSTWhy not check out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_in_the_United_Kingdom
and see how things work in our, bitter, post 1984 Socialist hell hole.
Your hate speech laws and arrests are, frankly, an embarrassment.
Quote: Paul Wimsett @ 14th June 2016, 3:41 PM BSTAs much as the killer?
Doubtful, as the Orlando shooter was trained at a police academy and was trained and licensed to act as an armed security guard. I doubt sooty can say the same.
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 3:46 PM BSTPoint a gun at a Japanese cop and see what happens.
That sounds like the worst idea for a holiday I heard in a long time.
Also with Japan's strice (US imposed nach) gun laws, I'd be in prison long before I ever got my hands on one.
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 3:46 PM BSTYour hate speech laws and arrests are, frankly, an embarrassment.
I'll live with the embarrassment and you can live with that...
http://www.vice.com/read/the-orlando-shooting-didnt-stop-the-anti-gay-protest-at-los-angeles-pride
although I'd be intrigued by which parts of our hate speech legislation, I'm especially supposed to be embarrassed about?
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:43 PM BSTAccording to FBI studies an experienced gun man can reload a pistol magazine in 2 seconds.
From your article;
Reloading takes under two. You just press the magazine release button with your shooting hand and insert the new magazine into the grip with your offhand. Experts holster extra ammunition on the side of their nonshooting hand to speed the exchange and can have the new magazine loaded before the empty one hits the ground.
Referred to an experienced gun man and even then said "can take under two"
is this really worth being pedantic and wrong about? You're not writing a speech for Trump you know.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:51 PM BSTI'll live with the embarrassment and you can live with that...
http://www.vice.com/read/the-orlando-shooting-didnt-stop-the-anti-gay-protest-at-los-angeles-pride
Seven idiots out of more than 20 million inhabitants of Los Angeles turn up to protest at a Pride march and are caged off by cops and ridiculed by marchers? Yeah, I can live with that and, no, I don't think people should be arrested for being insensitive assholes.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 3:51 PM BSTalthough I'd be intrigued by which parts of our hate speech legislation, I'm especially supposed to be embarrassed about?
The arrest of people for saying naughty things on social media, for example? I remember reading about a man who was arrested for teaching his dog to do the Nazi salute. Man, if that isn't a waste of a police officer's time...
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 4:00 PM BSTis this really worth being pedantic and wrong about?
You tell me, as you're the one who said that I was wrong and would continue to pint it out. The fact of the matter is that magazines can be swapped in the blink of an eye and it's highly unlikely that a shooter will be disarmed while changing magazines. I haven't heard that any of the people in the Orlando club tackled the shooter while he reloaded and the same goes for the cops.
So we should only be concerned about really big mobs?
Not small ones deliberately trying to upset people some of whom are in mourning?
What's the figure for when a mob is big enough to be an issue?
Quote: DaButt @ 14th June 2016, 4:16 PM BSTYou tell me, as you're the one who said that I was wrong and would continue to pint it out. The fact of the matter is that magazines can be swapped in the blink of an eye and it's highly unlikely that a shooter will be disarmed while changing magazines. I haven't heard that any of the people in the Orlando club tackled the shooter while he reloaded and the same goes for the cops.
Just Googled "tackled whilst reloading" and oddly enough got no porn results.
Google did pop up 2 different occaisons on page 1, Gifford and some shooting in Seattle.
Well done those heroes.
But to pull apart the silliness of your argument.
1 If skilled gunmen can reload like lightening and gun down have a go heroes. Simple bar skilled gun men from owning guns and only allow clumsy, inexperienced gun men to have guns.
2 Apply the same rules that Australia and the UK have, barring ownership of magazine fed high capacity fire arms, speed loaders etc.
I mean otherwise you're arguing your laws enable skilled gun men, with lots of bullets and the right gun to kill dozens. So we shouldn't do anything because...
actually that sentence is a puzzle there's no way I can make it, make sense.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 4:22 PM BSTSo we should only be concerned about really big mobs?
Not small ones deliberately trying to upset people some of whom are in mourning?
Sticks and stones, right? They were protesting legally in a spot cordoned off for them by the police. Nonviolent protest is healthy. I'm not in favor of arresting people who protest nonviolently, whether they are Fred Phelps' gang of attention-seeking nutjobs or hipsters waving "Trump = Hitler" signs at a rally.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 4:22 PM BST2 Apply the same rules that Australia and the UK have, barring ownership of magazine fed high capacity fire arms, speed loaders etc.
And in doing so you hobble the right to self-defence for every law-abiding American. What are the odds that the criminals who are already carrying firearms illegally will suddenly ditch their weapons for single-shot derringers?
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 4:22 PM BSTI mean otherwise you're arguing your laws enable skilled gun men, with lots of bullets and the right gun to kill dozens. So we shouldn't do anything because...
actually that sentence is a puzzle there's no way I can make it, make sense.
It's simple: laws that restrict magazine capacity and/or ban semi-automatic firearms harms our ability to defend ourselves from criminals.
Do you know what we should do while we're suggesting new gun control laws? We should pass a law that makes it illegal to murder people with guns.
Yeh I was reading up on that including some stuff you wrote about that compact revolver of yours.
About how when it would come down to the situation where you were facing someone trying to do you harm. You'd have 6 feet and 6 shots and either you get them or you don't.
Because you never struck me as one of those odd balls who'd strap a magazine fed, carbine to their chest and start an argument with a police officer.
I mean most countries with a serious violence problem, desperately want to get away from the situation. Where police and citizens wonder round strapped in to body armour carrying big guns and plenty of bullets. I can't see why any political movement would want to reverse that trend.
Quote: sootyj @ 14th June 2016, 4:46 PM BSTYeh I was reading up on that including some stuff you wrote about that compact revolver of yours.
About how when it would come down to the situation where you were facing someone trying to do you harm. You'd have 6 feet and 6 shots and either you get them or you don't.
My Smith & Wesson Model 642 is actually a 5-shot revolver. Not the ideal weapon for a shootout, especially since the barrel is very short, but most shootings take place at not much more than arm's length. Carjackings, etc.
I'm off to brew some beer. Cheers!
That's kind of what I meant, don't drink and reload you'll spill beer and bullets.