Dad's Army Page 15

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 9:48 PM BST

Has one different writer, Jeremy Lloyd ex husband of Joanna Lumley and co writer of the equally over praised Are You Being Served, having said that I do much prefer Allo Allo to Are You Being Served, but am firmly in the Jimmy Perry/David Croft group as opposed to the Jeremy Lloyd/David Croft camp. Note the use of camp in the latter teaming

Lloyd has stated it was inspired by Secret Army, even down to the way the resistance girls dressed in both shows.

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I thought she was married to Ade Edmondson?

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 9:48 PM BST

Lloyd has stated it was inspired by Secret Army, even down to the way the resistance girls dressed in both shows.

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Got a source for that? Because Lloyd's actually made clear he never saw Secret Army, having been working in the US at the time.

Maybe he's been misquoted as to the influence of different media on different aspects of the programme, or simply changed his story at different times.

Quote: David Smith @ May 30 2013, 9:50 PM BST

I thought she was married to Ade Edmondson?

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Wrong Absolutely Fabulous star. It's Jennifer Saunders who's married to Edmondson.

The show's premise was not to make fun of the war but to spoof war-based film and TV dramas, and in particular a BBC1 drama Secret Army, which ran from 1977 to 1979 and dealt with the activities of Belgian "escape line" that returned allied pilots to Britain, working from a Brussels cafe and later restaurant. Very many of the elements and characters are directly taken from Secret Army, such as the cafe owner having an affair in the restaurant under the nose of his wife, a bed-ridden woman in a room above who knocks on the floor for attention, a pianist who is also the forger, and the enmity between Gestapo and the German military. Many storylines for 'Allo 'Allo also derive directly from episodes of Secret Army, such as the valuable paintings and the accompanying forgeries, which in an episode from the second series of Secret Army both the Germans and the Resistance are seeking to obtain. Some actors from Secret Army also appear in 'Allo 'Allo!: Richard Marner, Guy Siner, John D. Collins, Hilary Minster and David Beckett. Inspiration was also drawn from patriotic black-and-white British melodramas of the 1940s.

Will there be a special documentary about Bill Pertwee?

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 9:53 PM BST

The show's premise was not to make fun of the war but to spoof war-based film and TV dramas, and in particular a BBC1 drama Secret Army, which ran from 1977 to 1979 and dealt with the activities of Belgian "escape line" that returned allied pilots to Britain, working from a Brussels cafe and later restaurant. Very many of the elements and characters are directly taken from Secret Army, such as the cafe owner having an affair in the restaurant under the nose of his wife, a bed-ridden woman in a room above who knocks on the floor for attention, a pianist who is also the forger, and the enmity between Gestapo and the German military. Many storylines for 'Allo 'Allo also derive directly from episodes of Secret Army, such as the valuable paintings and the accompanying forgeries, which in an episode from the second series of Secret Army both the Germans and the Resistance are seeking to obtain. Some actors from Secret Army also appear in 'Allo 'Allo!: Richard Marner, Guy Siner, John D. Collins, Hilary Minster and David Beckett. Inspiration was also drawn from patriotic black-and-white British melodramas of the 1940s.

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Yeah, you'll forgive me if I pay more attention to comedy historians, books and interviews than the ravings of Americans on Wikipedia.

Just to be clear: whether the show took elements of specific titles - Secret Army or others - and spoofed them (I'm sure it did), doesn't alter that 'Allo 'Allo! was not devised as a spoof of that particular programme, which was the original query.

(Also, we shouldn't be talking about this in the Dad's Army thread.)

Quote: Aaron @ May 30 2013, 9:59 PM BST

Yeah, you'll forgive me if I pay more attention to comedy historians, books and interviews than the ravings of Americans on Wikipedia.

Just to be clear: whether the show took elements of specific titles - Secret Army or others - and spoofed them (I'm sure it did), doesn't alter that 'Allo 'Allo! was not devised as a spoof of that particular programme, which was the original query.

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So many elements cannot be a coincidence, and excuse me if most so called comedy historians talk out of their backsides, most of them too young to remember the original transmissions.

PS your right its not really for this thread, but I didn't make the comparison

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 10:02 PM BST

So many elements cannot be a coincidence

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Like I say, it would be an odd spoof if one couldn't trace individual elements back to their routes. Doesn't mean that it was based on - that 'Allo 'Allo!'s entire creation was inspired by - the one title that the show's creator was on the other side of the world during the broadcast of, however.

Quote: Aaron @ May 30 2013, 10:09 PM BST

Like I say, it would be an odd spoof if one couldn't trace individual elements back to their routes. Doesn't mean that it was based on - that 'Allo 'Allo!'s entire creation was inspired by - the one title that the show's creator was on the other side of the world during the broadcast of, however.

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Co created surely. David Croft wasn't in America at the time

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 10:13 PM BST

Co created surely. David Croft wasn't in America at the time

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Nope. They were both always quite clear that it was specifically Jeremy Lloyd who came up with the idea of a sitcom about the French resistance.

Whilst lying alone underneath his own kitchen table, IIRC...

Quote: Aaron @ May 30 2013, 10:15 PM BST

Nope. They were both always quite clear that it was specifically Jeremy Lloyd who came up with the idea of a sitcom about the French resistance.

Whilst lying alone underneath his own kitchen table, IIRC...

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The idea maybe, but that doesn't mean Croft hadn't seen Secret Army and been influenced by it. I mean they run a cafe, have an invalid mother upstairs in bed, the look and feel of the settings is the same, the wife of the owner is a singer etc etc etc

Well the 'look and feel' is down to the production designer, DOP, the fact the shows are set in the same time period, and the filming methods, not the writing.

Quote: Aaron @ May 30 2013, 10:24 PM BST

Well the 'look and feel' is down to the production designer, DOP, the fact the shows are set in the same time period, and the filming methods, not the writing.

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But what about the basic set up, it is nearly identical. There may of been elements of Manhunt etc, but the cafe setup is exactly the same. To much of a coincidence for me that.

I really loved Secret Army and it is patently obvious 'Allo 'Allo! was based on it.

By the way isn't this the Dad's Army thread?

Quote: lofthouse @ May 30 2013, 9:32 PM BST

Isn't it accepted that Secret Army was the where the whole idea for 'Allo 'Allo! came?

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Yeah but that wasn't meant to be my point. Should've been clearer. From a 'writers' or writerly point of view, I meant. Secret Army thing or not, my point was I can definitely see similarities in comedy style in the later DAs. I can see a gradual lineage from DA to AA in a style way.

I suppose it's likely too that the camp influence of IAHHM, AYBS and HDH all led to the inevitable campness in AA. Now we're off topic.

Quote: Pingl @ May 30 2013, 9:48 PM BST

Having said that I do much prefer 'Allo 'Allo! to Are You Being Served?, but am firmly in the Jimmy Perry/David Croft group as opposed to the Jeremy Lloyd/David Croft camp. Note the use of camp in the latter teaming.

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Lloyd isn't the camper, that's Croft.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ May 31 2013, 8:36 AM BST

Yeah but that wasn't meant to be my point. Should've been clearer. From a 'writers' or writerly point of view, I meant. Secret Army thing or not, my point was I can definitely see similarities in comedy style in the later DAs. I can see a gradual lineage from DA to AA in a style way.

I suppose it's likely too that the camp influence of IAHHM, AYBS and HDH all led to the inevitable campness in AA. Now we're off topic.

Lloyd isn't the camper, that's Croft.

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That maybe true but the Perry/Croft stuff is much camper. I know there is a lot of campery in IAHHM but it's as nothing compared to AYBS? and 'Allo 'Allo!. And let's not forget the truly awful Mrs Noah. A comedy so mind blowingly bad that the mere mention of it can send shivers down the spine of any self respecting comedy writer. Oh Happy Band was better and less campy, but of course was really a star vehicle for the great, late Harry Worth.