Quote: Renegade Carpark @ December 11 2012, 6:45 PM GMTEh? I am warning about the rise of extreme right wing parties due to a lack of action on mass immigration in Europe. Why would I warn people of that if I was a rabid right wing mouthpiece?
Give him his due he got the rabid bit right 
Quote: Pingl @ December 11 2012, 6:55 PM GMTGive him his due he got the rabid bit right
I would prefer politically enthused to rabid.
Still, now that I'm a minority in London, I fully expect all Arts Council grants, BBC writing competitions, council housing allocations, etc to favour me from now on.
Quote: Tursiops @ December 11 2012, 2:24 PM GMTWog possibly derives from golliwog, rather than vice versa, but even that is uncertain - wog tended to be used more for olive skinned races. The original golliwog was a sympathetic, even heroic, character in a children's book. The depiction, and the dolls that followed, seem to owe more to the black face minstrel tradition than to any direct attempt to create a negro character. Enid Blyton is often cited as the source of negative connotations surrounding golliwogs, but for those of my generation the golliwog was familiar as a promotional figure for Robertson's jam, and had only positive connotations. I recall sending off the coupons to collect all the figurines in a golliwog jazz band, which rather reinforces the connection with the black-faced minstrel tradition.
The black-faced minstrel tradition is of course notably controversial. Its origins, certainly in England, go back centuries, and some Morris (i.e. Moorish) dancers still perform in blackface. The American manifestation undoubtedly reinforced stereotypes, though not entirely negative ones, but it also played a part in cultural cross-fertilisation, and therefore ultimately in changing attitudes. Those familiar only with the pasteurised Black & White Minstrel show will not be aware of what a vibrant cultural tradition blackface was in the late 1800s and early 1900s, or how important it was in the development of popular music.
The demonisation of the golliwog is something of a cultural oversimplification. Perhaps some black people do find it offensive, but are they right to do so? In the use of racially offensive language the law, quite correctly, requires that in order to be an offence there must be an intention to offend. I would consider that the the golliwog, of itself, represents no such intent.
As far as I am aware WOG derives from the initials of Western Oriental Gentleman so in itself is not particularly deriding.
So Golliwog probably came after the use of WOG.
Quote: billwill @ December 11 2012, 7:12 PM GMTAs far as I am aware WOG derives from the initials of Western Oriental Gentleman so in itself is not particularly deriding.
So Golliwog probably came after the use of WOG.
I dare you to shout it in a shopping centre and then expalin its derivation 
In the same way that 'negro' is just the latin for 'black'. t's the way the words have historically been used that defines their offensiveness.
Quote: Pingl @ December 11 2012, 7:21 PM GMTI dare you to shout it in a shopping centre and then expalin its derivation
Will all the Western Oriental Gentlemen, please stand on the left... Thank you.
I think originally it related to those of middle east and Indian origin, rather than black africans.
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ December 11 2012, 6:22 PM GMTThe extra foreign doctors and nurses are caring for the extra 7.5 million foreign patients. It's a circular argument.
Hmm, but if immigrants (and their children) are more likely to work as nurses than the indigenous population, then immigration should actually ease the strain on the NHS, right? Same applies to teachers and schools. Best to get those numbers before we start panicking I think.
Quote: billwill @ December 11 2012, 7:12 PM GMTAs far as I am aware WOG derives from the initials of Western Oriental Gentleman
I think traditionally it is Worthy Oriental Gentleman, but it is folk etymology I am afraid.
Gay marriage within the Church of England is to be made against the law. What is the point of that, a law to stop something Cameron is meant to believe in, what a bunch of useless dicks this coalition are. They really haven't the foggiest. They are now introducing legislation against the very thing they are in favour of, making the need for legislation needless as that is how things stand at the moment, joined up government at its most disjointed.
Quote: Pingl @ December 11 2012, 8:21 PM GMTGay marriage within the Church of England is to be made against the law.
My previous explanation -
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ December 11 2012, 2:20 PM GMTLet's change it from gay marriage to re-introducing smoking in pubs. JD Weatherspoons says it's totally against it and so refuses to opt-in to the new law and the Government backs off saying they respect Weatherspoon's right to not allow smoking.
However, smaller pub chains will allow smoking, so the law is still in effect, but just in fewer locations.
I don't know why religion hating athiests, who support non-traditional relationships, are getting worked up about this. If you want the Government to legislate religion and interfere with the belief systems of practicing worshippers, then you are on a very slippery slope.
So come on Cameron, force every Muslim to be gay and get married, ya coward!
You're on a roll today aren't you!
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ December 11 2012, 9:12 PM GMTMy previous explanation -
I don't know why religion hating athiests, who support non-traditional relationships, are getting worked up about this. If you want the Government to legislate religion and interfere with the belief systems of practicing worshippers, then you are on a very slippery slope.
So come on Cameron, force every Muslim to be gay and get married, ya coward!
It's more the fact they are legislating for no reason, so blinkered that they will introduce a law even if it says the exact opposite of what they intended
Quote: zooo @ December 11 2012, 9:15 PM GMTYou're on a roll today aren't you!
It is so difficult to bring enlightment to the masses. I am the very text book definition of an intellectual.
Quote: Pingl @ December 11 2012, 9:20 PM GMTIt's more the fact they are legislating for no reason, so blinkered that they will introduce a law even if it says the exact opposite of what they intended
They made it a law that gay people can get married in church...and they can. What's the problemo?
Quote: Renegade Carpark @ December 11 2012, 9:23 PM GMTIt is so difficult to bring enlightment to the masses. I am the very text book definition of an intellectual.
They made it a law that gay people can get married in church...and they can. What's the problemo?
They are now making it the law that gay people cannot marry in a C of E church, what is the point
That textbook being Janet and John
Quote: Pingl @ December 11 2012, 9:25 PM GMTThey are now making it the law that gay people cannot marry in a C of E church, what is the point
The point is they can get married in any number of churches, from a number of different denominations and have their gay love blessed by God.
Wouldn't it make sense to have the nuptials in a place of worship where the God approved of their relationships?
What am I missing here?
