Does one need to go to Oxbridge to stand a chance Page 5

And you know, do you? It's an old maxim of the acting industry. The quote goes something like 'RADA will get you a dressing room at the Old Vic with your own dresser but Oxford'll get you a department at the BBC with your own secretary.' There was a lot of this jostling for talented arty types in the 50s and 60s. Many famous actORs turned down an offer from Oxbridge to go to RADA, unusual till then, like Robert Shaw. If you think it's bollocks then please go and tell them that, I think Robert Hardy's still alive.

A lot of this discussion hinges on whether or not people in broadcasting who commission scripts or cast shows - scripted or sketch - read CVs and judge talent accordingly. They don't. Talent will lead to a career, not educational background. For all the people who went to Oxford or Cambridge or RADA and who have become successful there are many many more who sought a career and failed. Contacts open doors, but the doors slam shut if the people concerned aren't up to it.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ October 6 2012, 11:08 AM BST

And you know, do you? It's an old maxim of the acting industry. The quote goes something like 'RADA will get you a dressing room at the Old Vic with your own dresser but Oxford'll get you a department at the BBC with your own secretary.' There was a lot of this jostling for talented arty types in the 50s and 60s. Many famous actORs turned down an offer from Oxbridge to go to RADA, unusual till then, like Robert Shaw. If you think it's bollocks then please go and tell them that, I think Robert Hardy's still alive.

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And still it continues. Your statement... let me remind you was 'A RADA degree might not get you a career as a famous comedy writer/performer like Cleese or Cook but an Oxbridge degree will.' An oxbridge degree will get you a career as a famous comedy writer/performer!! Absolute bollocks. ANd yes I do know. I don't think Robert Hardy needs advice from you either

Quote: Micheal Jacob @ October 6 2012, 11:20 AM BST

A lot of this discussion hinges on whether or not people in broadcasting who commission scripts or cast shows - scripted or sketch - read CVs and judge talent accordingly. They don't. Talent will lead to a career, not educational background. For all the people who went to Oxford or Cambridge or RADA and who have become successful there are many many more who sought a career and failed. Contacts open doors, but the doors slam shut if the people concerned aren't up to it.

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Micheal surely script editing 101. Keep it simple. No excess words less is more. All you needed to say was.

'Absolute bollocks!'

I thank you.

Quote: Micheal Jacob @ October 6 2012, 11:20 AM BST

A lot of this discussion hinges on whether or not people in broadcasting who commission scripts or cast shows - scripted or sketch - read CVs and judge talent accordingly.

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I don't think it does actually. The issues are more complex than that.

Contacts open doors, but the doors slam shut if the people concerned aren't up to it.

Quite, and quite. I might find some of the performers listed atrocious, but they would not have had a career if someone had not believed in them.

Quote: Marc P @ October 6 2012, 11:23 AM BST

And still it continues. Your statement... let me remind you was 'A RADA degree might not get you a career as a famous comedy writer/performer like Cleese or Cook but an Oxbridge degree will.' An oxbridge degree will get you a career as a famous comedy writer/performer!!

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I think it's been proven many times over that it's true. Are you willfully misreading the sense of the word 'will' here to fit your agenda? Can, does then, that better? You know I didn't mean 'will always, to everyone' but 'will to the selected few.' Blimey, the lengths you go to.

And I mentioned Hardy as I think it's his quote or a line out of one of his biographies. I think he was saying that just because he chose Oxford, didn't mean that he didn't want purely to be an actor. In the 60s there was a trend of giving more credibility to drama school trained actors.

However you look at it, the apparent difference in the social and educational backgrounds of stand ups and sketch performers is an interesting phenomenon that requires more explanation than, "bollocks".

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ October 6 2012, 11:40 AM BST

I think it's been proven many times over that it's true. Are you willfully misreading the sense of the word 'will' here to fit your agenda? Can, does then, that better? You know I didn't mean 'will always, to everyone' but 'will to the selected few.' Blimey, the lengths you go to.

And I mentioned Hardy as I think it's his quote or a line out of one of his biographies. I think he was saying that just because he chose Oxford, didn't mean that he didn't want purely to be an actor. In the 60s there was a trend of giving more credibility to drama school trained actors.

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Saying something has been proven many times over doesn't mean anything. Where is this empirical truth?
And sorry, but if you don't mean what you say might I suggest you say what you mean. As Micheal says, people are interested in talent not certificates.

I know Michael worked there but I don't believe the Oxbridge connection has no bearing at all. It's good that some of their execs like him treat allcomers in an equal unbiased way, but I assume as many others still look to Footlights in particular as a steady source of talent for TV, in front of and behind the camera.

There must be a preference given to the Oxbridge crowd for first time TV work or how else can one explain the point the poster made, that non elite uni type people who want a career in comedy usually have to start in stand up? Whereas so many elite uni type people who want a career in comedy manage to glide straight into TV after a stint in Footlights. It is a bit of a blaring imbalance to simply dismiss as as a rubbish conspiracy.

It's no coincidence, Footlights was set up for this very purpose and is still very productive in furnishing broadcasters with talent. It's the showbiz version of the political clubs and debating societies there. Elitist feeder centres.

Have you ever worked in the industry in any capacity Alfred, or are your thoughts based simply on what other people have said and a sort of general idea of how you think happens. TV is weighted no differently in regards to the oxbridge factor as any other industry. You come to a company with a portfolio and some proof of future ability,that's what they look at. You can build such a portfolio from any other university, or indeed never going to University at all.

But when it comes to the all important interview/audition, and this is a massively competitive industry to try and enter, you have say 12 applicants shorlisted for one opening. The prod looks at their porfolios and all being similarly impressive, he notices 'ah Magaulbelen (pron. gobbling) College, that's my old college'. Oh well, must do what one has to do, shame about the others. And that's really the point of the old school network, that's its job. Cameron-Osbourne-Mitchell, and all the many other examples of reunited little elites at the top of their profession. Banks, Corporations, Broadcasters, they all do the same.

I'm slightly tounge in cheek with that splurge because I believe real talent today regardless of background does get through yes, but I'm sure it has to really shine out to stand out above the top stuff, who've been hothoused to be the best after all. In short, it's hard competing against them toffs.

I remember reading about Rob Brydon who sent video after video in before he even got a look at, then quickly became a huge TV success and got his own chat show. He wouldn't have had to do that if he'd gone to Oxbridge.

So just guessing

Well no not really, when there've been books and books written about how good uni connections get people ahead, listing thousands of examples. That is their purpose! Why have league tables for unis if their influence for grads is totally equal? I don't know where you get this evreyone has an equal chance nonsense from. It's not reality.

Submitting creative work anonamously is different tho yes, without CVs or agents, and based soley on merit. Praise must go to the BBC for starting Writers Room, even tho it doesn't appear to have produced many household names as yet.

References?

Doesnt sound like a very good book to me? ANd there are lots of them you say?

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ October 6 2012, 2:54 PM BST

' I don't know where you get this evreyone has an equal chance nonsense from. '

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I have to say neither do I? Do you have a reference for that also??

I don't keep them. Every September you'll find a guide stating the stats of each uni and giving it a rating, its own or an official one, and most will give the allumni. I suggest comparing say, Bolton Modern Pyrotechnic's with Oxford's. One might be a bit longer than the other.

Did you go to college Alfred, or work hard at school so to do etc??