Quote: Frantically @ September 24 2011, 9:52 PM BSTI tend to write broader, gag-based stuff usually because beautifully-wrought character-comedy relies on the skill of the actor as much as, or more than the writer.
This is not true.
The Sitcom Mission 2012 Page 8
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Quote: Marc P @ September 24 2011, 9:57 PM BSTThis is not true.
Ok, I admit I can't do gags either.
Good man. 
Quote: Marc P @ September 24 2011, 9:57 PM BSTThis is not true.
Seconded, that's like saying that all books are just, flat emotionless pages of dialogue and scenery description until a great director and team of actors makes them into a play or film.
But think of Rab C or Steptoe or Fletcher or Bilko or Victor Meldrew or Martin from EDC or Del Boy or ... well you get the idea. These were envisioned and created by writers.
I am not sure which way Mark is going with this (either both do or neither do) but I would agree if he is saying the former. Thunderer was pretty gag based (in my opinion)but the excellent actors 'sold' the gags so effectively that they seemed natural. Where NGO leaves me cold is that large parts of it do just sound like Vine and Mack doing standup with, as has been said, the plot tacked around it. So I guess I think NGO might work with less well known faces if they were more adept as actors. It would feel different but it might work.
What you really want is a great piece of written work put into the hands of just the right performer.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2011, 10:11 PM BSTWhat you really want is a great piece of written work put into the hands of just the right performer.
Come on Matthew don't fire the Bussell publicly like this!
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2011, 10:11 PM BSTWhat you really want is a great piece of written work put into the hands of just the right performer.
That's when stuff really flies. I have seen bad performers suck the life out of a very good script, and vice versa. It can be odd things too. The American version of MASH was ruined for me by the simple addition of a laugh track.
Quote: Marc P @ September 24 2011, 10:13 PM BSTCome on Matthew don't fire the Bussell publicly like this!
Never. With a bit of work, he'll be this decades John Inman. If he reins in the camp a touch.
Quote: sean knight @ September 24 2011, 10:07 PM BSTSeconded, that's like saying that all books are just, flat emotionless pages of dialogue and scenery description until a great director and team of actors makes them into a play or film.
I'm talking purely about scripts here. Scripts aren't the end product, books are. With books there's no-one needed to interpret the words to realise the vision for the reader. A script needs actors/directors etc. My point about Partridge - and I think it probably goes for sitcoms like 'Curb...' and some others - is that the skill of the actors should be recognised. I could never write something like Alan Partridge (shocked? 
) for many reasons, but the main one is not working with someone like Steve Coogan.
Not saying I could write Not Going Out either, I should add.
I agree with Matthew. What a lot of 'readers' of the scripts just don't visualise is the actor's response/expression to a funny line. The reaction is far more important/hilarious than the action/the actor that's saying the line.
I think you need to think of the script as the end product as you have pretty much no control over who gets to direct or act it out for you. Also if it isn't putting the pictures you see in your head into someone elses then it's not doing the job. If you want 15 pages of jokes buy a joke book. You need to create life essentialy. Invent characters and bring them to life with nothing more than dialogue and stage direction.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ September 24 2011, 10:19 PM BSTNever. With a bit of work, he'll be this decades John Inman. If he reins in the camp a touch.
Wow - get into a debate, there's a response, go to reply...and in the meantime there's been 7 other posts??
It's Saturday night and we're posting on the 'net? I can't believe you're all as sad as me!
Makes me feel better about myself though