Quote: sootyj @ January 13 2011, 7:29 PM GMTUnstable behaviour in the absence of guns/knives/swords/spears/ropes/lighters/cars/trucks/airplanes/gasoline/rocks/bricks/bats/sticks/screwdrivers/scissors/poison/arrows/dogs/bottles/boots/corkscrews/fists is less of an issue.
Agreed. We should outlaw them all.
with that logic everything should be legal
Quote: Schwen @ January 13 2011, 7:36 PM GMTwith that logic everything should be legal
There are very few things that a law-abiding citizen should be forbidden to own, especially defensive items in the privacy his own home. I'd much rather the government prosecute and punish those who break the laws rather than remove freedoms from those who follow them. Murder is already illegal, so why do we need more and more and more gun laws?
To stop people shooting each other
I don't understand how you don't get this. With guns, the bad outweighs the good, the cons overcome the pros, the bullets kill the people
Quote: Schwen @ January 13 2011, 7:51 PM GMTTo stop people shooting each other
Drop what you're doing and go to your kitchen and throw out all your cutlery. Have your car crushed, throw all your glasses and bottles and mirrors away and then dispose of any golf clubs, cricket bats, bowling balls ... hell, throw away anything heavier than a marshmallow. It'll stop you from hurting someone.
None of those things (other than a car) will allow me the ability to relatively easily kill and/or injure one or multiple persons in a fit of rage/emotional breakdown/being"f**king mental"
Furthermore, none of those things are designed to kill.
I see your point with regards to enjoying freedoms, I really do, but there has to be a line somewhere. I think we're on pretty much the same level here, it's just you really enjoy guns and I don't
Quote: Schwen @ January 13 2011, 8:09 PM GMTNone of those things (other than a car) will allow me the ability to relatively easily kill and/or injure one or multiple persons in a fit of rage/emotional breakdown/being"f**king mental"
You can kill someone easily with any of the items I mentioned. In places like Africa tens of thousands of people have been murdered with knives and spears and garden implements. Where there's a will there's a way.
Quote: Schwen @ January 13 2011, 8:09 PM GMTI see your point with regards to enjoying freedoms, I really do, but there has to be a line somewhere. I think we're on pretty much the same level here, it's just you really enjoy guns and I don't
Exactly. I have the constitutionally provided right to own a firearms if I so choose. People who choose not to are free to do as they wish. Individual liberties are very important in maintaining a healthy society. Governments should be very wary of taking away the freedoms of its citizens "for their own good." A government that has hundreds of millions of armed citizens is very unlikely to abuse its power to any great extent and that's a good thing.
You can kill with those items, just not as easliy as you can a gun in a fit of rage, you missed or ignored my point entirely.
And it's not protecting people from themselves, it's protecting people from each other, it's a whole world apart and I don't think you can justify your point.
I hate pointless debates so I'm out
But all we have is pointless debates
Come Back Schwane
Quote: Schwen @ January 13 2011, 9:20 PM GMTAnd it's not protecting people from themselves, it's protecting people from each other
As I said, burn your cricket bat and hand your kitchen knives over to the police in order to protect your neighbors from yourself. It's the right thing to do.
Quote: DaButt @ January 13 2011, 8:43 PM GMTYou can kill someone easily with any of the items I mentioned. In places like Africa tens of thousands of people have been murdered with knives and spears and garden implements. Where there's a will there's a way. Exactly. I have the constitutionally provided right to own a firearms if I so choose. People who choose not to are free to do as they wish. Individual liberties are very important in maintaining a healthy society. Governments should be very wary of taking away the freedoms of its citizens "for their own good." A government that has hundreds of millions of armed citizens is very unlikely to abuse its power to any great extent and that's a good thing.
Isn't that what just happened, DaButt? An American citizen, albeit a mental one whipped into a frenzy by an irresponsible media and a fear mongering political movement, was concerned that the government was trampling on his rights took a stand?
Quote: DaButt @ January 13 2011, 8:02 PM GMTDrop what you're doing and go to your kitchen and throw out all your cutlery. Have your car crushed, throw all your glasses and bottles and mirrors away and then dispose of any golf clubs, cricket bats, bowling balls ... hell, throw away anything heavier than a marshmallow. It'll stop you from hurting someone.
DaButt's absolutely right.
We need *more* nuclear weapons, not less. The nuclear deterrent is a deterrent. If we liberalize the ownership of nuclear weapons, then everybody will be able to defend themselves. Including the Iranians, North Koreans, Al Qaeda, that bloke I met down the pub last night...
Quote: chipolata @ January 13 2011, 9:56 PM GMTAn American citizen, albeit a mental one whipped into a frenzy by an irresponsible media and a fear mongering political movement
You're making that up out of thin air. As I've said several times, his friends say he leaned left and there is not a sliver of evidence that shows he paid any attention to the Tea Party or Republicans in general. But there is physical and historical evidence which shows that the shooter had personal and acrimonious encounters with the congresswoman back in 2007 when the Tea Party didn't exist and nobody knew who Sarah Palin was.
>simply another attempt by those who would take away our Second Amendment rights to interfere with the ownership of firearms by law-abiding people
That part of that sentence does not seem to make sense in English.
BTW: what I proposed would not cost the taxpayer, it should be the arms makers shouldering the costs.