England v Croatia Page 11

This post is to do with a particular brand within Islam rather than Islam as a whole.

The classic dichotomy in certain Islamic thought was revealed by the poster in London during the Danish Cartoon Wars: "Behead all those that say Islam is violent." My initial reaction was to laugh out loud at the picture but on reflection it is sickeningly real.

Dialogue with this particular thought within Islam is impossible. Unreasoning minds can't grasp reason. Even a child can see the abscence of logic in the posters and placards but ideology isn't about logic. It's about self-perpetuation and growth, despite logic.

Sadly, this ideology will continue to grow as this branch of Muslim 'might' is seen to face-off and 'beat' the West. More arabic children will be taught nursery songs about eating the flesh of their enemies. More children will declare their intent on TV chat shows to become suicide bombers to claps and cries of 'Bravo' (sic) from the studio crew. More parents will mould their babies into the fuel to turn the world into a vast abattoir of paradox where law is unlawful, and right is wrong, and killing is good, and compassion is weak. I hope I'm wrong but history shows that a radicalised motivated minority will always defeat the decadent majority.

Where this leaves the lady in Sudan? Most of the protests are probably stage managed to put the heat on the UK government. To the Sudanese she's a pawn to demonstrate how weak the West is. One more victory to give to the radicalised sector of Islam. That's why they were so keen to get the radical imam in court, to associate the 'victory' with that sector within Islam.

Our government are certainly too decadent to care enough to deal with extremism in our own country effectively, in my view.

And the lady in the Sudan jail will just have to wait until the Sudanese let her go and that'll be when they've had their fill of the political opportunity it has represented.

Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 3:44 AM

They authorities think she has broken the law so they've arrested her. The law in Sudan is different than here and she is subject to the local law as she is living there. Seems fair enough to me. She should abide by the courts judgement or appeal, if their system allows appeals (which I think it does). I must admit I can't see a problem at the moment.

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Sharia law seems fair enough to you? How would you like it if a court judged you on what some guy would or would not have done over a thousand years ago? The problem with these radical countries is that they are living in what we would call the past but it took several inquisitions, the collapse of the European empires, 2 World Wars, the 60s and communism to bring most of Europe to its senses. America has hardly seperated church from state and all these 'extremist' countries have is there religious belief. There seems two ways to go either ignore them, which is impossible as they own all the oil or just wait for them to come round. Nothing else will work we have to be pragmatic.

As for teacher its ridiculous and sad.

Quote: ajp29 @ December 1, 2007, 2:09 PM

Sharia law seems fair enough to you? How would you like it if a court judged you on what some guy would or would not have done over a thousand years ago? The problem with these radical countries is that they are living in what we would call the past but it took several inquisitions, the collapse of the European empires, 2 World Wars, the 60s and communism to bring most of Europe to its senses. America has hardly seperated church from state and all these 'extremist' countries have is there religious belief. There seems two ways to go either ignore them, which is impossible as they own all the oil or just wait for them to come round. Nothing else will work we have to be pragmatic.

As for teacher its ridiculous and sad.

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Agree on the teacher, but to follow through your argument. If they can't have their own law in their own country then why can we have ours? You can't have it both ways was the point I was trying to make.

Of course all of Sharia law isn't fair (some of it might be though). I don't think all of our laws are fair either. There is no real 'universal fair' in any of this, humanity isn't and never has been a fair place and neither has politics.

As for what we can do about it, I think we can only do what we are doing unless we want to be radical ourselves, and we don't like that kind of thing anymore, rightly or wrongly. In the end I think, force will be met by force if it gets bad enough.

If our Western Governments had been doing their jobs properly over the last 50 years, we wouldn't be so reliant on oil at all. But we don't have good government because they are human.

Apes would be no better though, I saw it in a film!

Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 3:30 PM

Agree on the teacher, but to follow through your argument. If they can't have their own law in their own country then why can we have ours? You can't have it both ways was the point I was trying to make.

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Er when did I say that?

Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 3:30 PM

As for what we can do about it, I think we can only do what we are doing unless we want to be radical ourselves, and we don't like that kind of thing anymore, rightly or wrongly. In the end I think, force will be met by force if it gets bad enough.

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I said we should be pragmatic. Did you read any of my post before you whipped out your sword of truth?

i thought crouch had a decent game.

Quote: Frankie Rage @ December 1, 2007, 3:44 AM

They authorities think she has broken the law so they've arrested her. The law in Sudan is different than here and she is subject to the local law as she is living there. Seems fair enough to me.

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I agree. This woman has been a teacher for what, 30 years, I think I read? And has supposedly travelled "extensively" around the world. I just can't understand how she could be so naive in going to such a backwards country and society, without aiming to grasp some better understanding of the law!

At the same time however, the Sudanese Government are showing themselves to be a joke to the rest of the world, and by any civilised standards, what is happening is thoroughly abhorrent.

As for the argument about beating extremism, governments, oil and such, I'm increasingly wondering if we do just need to bomb the shit out of them, no questions asked. On home soil, I've read suggestions that we need to scrap the Human Rights Act (or at very least thoroughly re-work it), as it's restricting what we can realistically accomplish in terms of crackdowns, zero tolerance and such. I'm sure that Adam may have a better understanding there though.

Quote: johnny roulette @ December 1, 2007, 5:06 PM

i thought crouch had a decent game.

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Agreed. I don't understand why he isn't a regular first choice for Benny Tez.

i'm pleased that he's not because i've got torres and voronin in my fantasy league team.

Quote: johnny roulette @ December 1, 2007, 5:15 PM

i've got torres and voronin

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sounds like you need antibiotics

the creams keep it under control.

Quote: Aaron @ December 1, 2007, 5:09 PM

I'm sure that Adam may have a better understanding there though.

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Worrying times when people are looking for me for advice. Parliament can scrap the Human Rights Act as they can, like all laws including EU regulations can overturn it. They can do whatever they like. Its the system we have.

Where the Human Rights Act is restrictive is that public bodies like the council or courts have to abide by it. So thats why you get Police giving criminals KFC on the roof.

Quote: ajp29 @ December 1, 2007, 6:02 PM

So thats why you get Police giving criminals KFC on the roof.

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Did the alleged human rights violation come before or afterwards?

Quote: Badge @ December 1, 2007, 6:07 PM

Did the alleged human rights violation come before or afterwards?

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We should ask Hugh Fernly Whhatshisname if the chicken's rights were violated

No Chickens were violated they were all willing participants