Quote: Gavin @ May 29 2010, 12:10 PM BSTThat whole "moments that must happen" is poppi cock.
Gavin, the series isn't real, certain things are made up, that's how fiction works! Things are invented! Ships can't fly warp speed either! 
Doctor Who... Page 490
Quote: sootyj @ May 29 2010, 12:13 PM BSTGavin you are starting to sound like a Target Book written by Chris Ryan.
Operation Dalek f**k?
I'm an efficent multi-verse killing machine.
Surely it'd be Operation: Pepper Pot F**k.
Not to be mistaken with Operation: F**k Pepper Pots.
To entirely different missions.
Quote: Gavin @ May 29 2010, 11:50 AM BSTHe survived cause it was convient.
Well yeah, there wouldn't be a series otherwise! Captain Kirk only survived every week because he was the lead character!
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 12:19 PM BSTWell yeah, there wouldn't be a series otherwise! Captain Kirk only survived every week because he was the lead character!
Captain Kirk can't regenerate though can he?
oooooooo That's the other thing have we dropped the 13 regenerations now? Because he's coming up around there now surely brown trousers time for old Mr. Doctor.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 12:18 PM BSTGavin, the series isn't real, certain things are made up, that's how fiction works! Things are invented! Ships can't fly warp speed either!
Doctor Who isn't as airtight as a lot of SF series. That may or may not be part of it's charm, although it's certainly doesn't hold up to too much scrutiny.
And I think the fact we've had two distinctive periods of DW - Classic Who and New Who - just adds to the inconsistencies.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 12:19 PM BSTWell yeah, there wouldn't be a series otherwise! Captain Kirk only survived every week because he was the lead character!
Trek's a much, much tighter show with a more solid universe.
Quote: chipolata @ May 29 2010, 12:21 PM BSTDoctor Who isn't as airtight as a lot of SF series.
Yep, sure, mainly because they didn't care about that in the past, they were making it up as they went along, and ignoring often what had gone before. I mean, regeneration was only thought up as they didn't want to end the series when Hartnell left. There's a lot that doesn't add up if you compare what was said in an episode in 1968 to a one put out in 2006, but I'm not bothered, Who is very much a show that has changed every few years and made it up as it went along at times.
As Pratchett said, it isn't proper sci-fi, in the way he means it, it's fantasy and doesn't always hold up to scrutiny.
Quote: chipolata @ May 29 2010, 12:22 PM BSTTrek's a much, much tighter show with a more solid universe.
It's a much simpler show, and didn't go for an unbroken run of almost thirty years, The original only went, for instance, for about three years, so it didn't have as much chance to muck upo it's own time line and cannon.
Two very different shows anyway.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 12:25 PM BSTit didn't have as much chance to muck up it's own time line and cannon.
I'm pretty sure they used phasers.
Quote: Badge @ May 29 2010, 12:27 PM BSTI'm pretty sure they used phasers.
>_<
Quote: Gavin @ May 29 2010, 12:21 PM BSTCaptain Kirk can't regenerate though can he?
oooooooo That's the other thing have we dropped the 13 regenerations now? Because he's coming up around there now surely brown trousers time for old Mr. Doctor.
I'm sure they'll make something up to get around it. The Master, for instance, has now gone on longer than that. And they've had things where they have been given a whole new regeneration cycle, and it's been suggested 13 was a self imposed limit, so they couldn't live forever, so that could be fixed somehow. Or he could poke the sonic screwdriver in his ear and it'll magically allow him to carry on regenerating, it seems to be able to do most other things.
Anyway, they'll get around it somehow!
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 12:35 PM BSTAnyway, they'll get around it somehow!
Or not. Who knows how long Doctor Who as a series will last. At some point it'll start looking tired and get cancelled. It's pretty much the fate of all shows.
Quote: sootyj @ May 29 2010, 11:21 AM BSTAnd frankly f**king Robin Hood has had enough Bassett's taken that a black Tuck is no less ridiculous then him wearing a hoody, boffing Marian and being some sort of magic spirit with Timotei hair.
Don't forget the black Friar Tuck was also a martial arts expert. I don't know why they didn't go the whole hog and make him invisible. Even the actor who played him admitted he couldn't believe it when he read the script.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 11:41 AM BSTI assumed the war happened because either the Daleks decided to wage war on the Time Lords in ther quest to be the ultimate masters of the universe, or the Time Lords threw the firt punch as they decided to finally get rid of the Daleks, something they had tried to do before, even attempting in one story to stop their very creation.
The war happened because Russell T Davies was 'talent-locked' and he need a quick and dirty way to generate sympathy for his character.
I thought the Time War was one of RTD's better conceits, a piece of mythmaking that gave the dynamic of the show a fresh edge for a new era.
What does bother me is the increasingly God-like powers given to the Doctor as the series progressed. The Doctor should be a brilliant improviser, the extent of his powers in the new show - and that bloody sonic screwdriver - make it all too easy for him. (Contrast the decision in the original series to drop K9 because his ability to act as deus ex machina in resolving storylines detracted from the drama.)
Quote: Godot Taxis @ May 29 2010, 1:17 PM BSTThe war happened because Russell T Davies was 'talent-locked' and he need a quick and dirty way to generate sympathy for his character.
However, I've only ever heard praise for his writing skills from BBC sources.Most often from Davies himself.
Quote: Godot Taxis @ May 29 2010, 1:17 PM BSTThe war happened because Russell T Davies was 'talent-locked' and he need a quick and dirty way to generate sympathy for his character.
It happened because he wanted to get rid of the Time Lords. You, I, or anyone else may not like the conceit, but it's perfectly valid, I don't see what's so bad about it. Other than you don't like it.
Quote: chipolata @ May 29 2010, 12:43 PM BSTOr not. Who knows how long Doctor Who as a series will last. At some point it'll start looking tired and get cancelled. It's pretty much the fate of all shows.
Yes, at some point it will end, but it's only a couple of regenerations away from the cut off number, I would say it will reach it. And, as RTD said, even if the series gets dropped again, which it obviously will sooner or later, it will come back again, if only because it's worked once, so at some point someone else will try it again. Same with Star Trek, at some point there will be a new TV series, just because it's worked several times in the past.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ May 29 2010, 1:43 PM BSTIt happened because he wanted to get rid of the Time Lords.
You're missing a rather significant point here - he "didn't* get rid of the Time Lords. Hence it *was* a lazy half-arsed conceit to turn on emotion like a tap.
Before you argue the toss, the Master is a Time Lord isn't he? And who the hell was Timothy Dalton playing last Christmas?
Quote: Badge @ May 29 2010, 1:52 PM BSTYou're missing a rather significant point here - he "didn't* get rid of the Time Lords. Hence it *was* a lazy half-arsed conceit to turn on emotion like a tap.
Before you argue the toss, the Master is a Time Lord isn't he? And who the hell was Timothy Dalton playing last Christmas?
I wasn't going to argue the toss. The idea is valid, but he went and messed it up, yes, by bringing them back. The same way he ruined getting rid of Rose, by bringing her back, and the end he gave Tate by bringing her back. The idea was fine, but he couldn't leave it alone and went back on what he set up. That's what is wrong in my eyes, not the idea itself.