Quote: Marc P @ April 19 2010, 2:14 PM BSTMore like Giles from the allotment probably.
I'm sticking with Giles from Buffy..
I've written a sitcom... Page 3
Hi there, maffew, I am a complete noob, so feel free to dismiss my thoughts.
These other guys here are giving great advice, but matt, I just wanna point out that different people have extremely different notions of what is "funny". So any such criticisms should be taken by you with a pinch of salt. That kind of advice is not worthless: no way! But it's not definitive. However, comedy is also drama, and therefore any criticisms along those dramatic lines should be paid much closer attention to by you. I guess what I'm saying is that you don't have to feel like you need to conform to other people's notions of funny (and I'm only vaguely referring to this thread now, to be honest), but you do need to conform to certain dramatic conventions and techniques for the benefit of your comedy!
(Also, FWIW, the rape stuff was very funny. That line was pretty tame by, say, South Park's standards, but these guys are right-- by the standards of, say, a BBC sitcom, maybe not so tame... but try not to compromise your vision too much at this early stage: tons of people will do that for you at a slightly later one!!! 
).
Anyway, I liked the script, but you didn't ask for compliments, but criticism, so I will try to give you some of my thoughts without saying again too much what's already been said by the splendid fellows above.
* Why give exact ages? E.G. "DAN YOUNG (26)". Why not say "mid-twenties"?
* Don't direct actors by telling them where to pause. If it's vital, okay, but if not (as it isn't for the most part in your screenplay in my humble view), then don't bother. Sure, you know how the actor "should" say it -- so do I and everyone else who writes!! -- but that's just tough luck for us writers!
* There's no need to write "END SCENE".
* 'A picture of a young man. She slams the picture down. Ellie: "Oh God! Everything I look at reminds me of him"'
I feel like you could be missing a joke here. That is, not making the most of the comic potential. I'll just leave that thought with you. 
(I'm not trying to be clever and obscurantist, by the way, it's just that it's not my sitcom and not my vision, but I feel like you could make more of that moment and similar ones).
* Amidst the crowd of youngsters they look old and weathered despite their youth". A very nice moment, perhaps that all us twenty-somethings have at one stage when we realise we are not exactly "young young" any more, kinda heading otu of it.... but I didn't feel the impact I should have. Try to reword this bit to make it more visual, more gripping. What imagery could spell your point out? That is, show it with your words instead of explaining it with your words. For example, let's talk poetry a bit (something I like). Don't write "I love you so much I want to die without you blah blah blah". Instead, write something more along the lines of John Clare in "First Love"; he SHOWS us instead of explaining what this love is like. P.S. Read John Clare!! 
* A similar moment to the one I just mentioned "Dan thinks for a moment and points the tips of his index
fingers at each other and taps them together quickly, as if
this is how homosexual men have sex - by tapping the ends of
their willies together. Ellie laughs."
maffew, this is a funny moment (for me, at least!) and I feel like you wreck it for the actors, directors, scriptreaders, etc, by explaining the joke to us. We all KNOW that gay men don't have sex this way (well... okay, let's no go there), so you can cut most of that.
Also, I feel like you don't pack as much punch into this joke as possible. Again, only my humble pure n00b opinion, but I feel like something along the following lines would be better: 'ELLIE fumbles her hands uselessly. DAN taps his erect forefingers together rapidly. ELLIE laughs [despite herself]'. But maybe without "Despite herself".
I don't want to give a line-by-line critique, for I don't think that would be helpful. However, I think the above examples and points kinda spell out most of my criticisms. But please I don't want you to get depressed, I actually really like your script (kinda along my lines of humour, actually). But, as you rightly (bravely!) said, you need to know what is wrong, not what is right.
Hope I've been of help, man. Take it easy,
Bryan
I like the stage direction 'despite herself' it's a good one.
@Bryan:
Great crit, thanks!
Right..I know what I think is funny, and that's how I'm going to write - I saw the Persuasionists, and that's what made me start writing this. It was painfully bad.. I've been watching Pulling recently and that's the kind of tone I'm going for - kind of dark, occasionally mean spirited but with a good heart, and I'd hope to be able to leave some of the nastier bits in.. someone pointed out in the second draft they are quite harsh, and they don't want to err on the side of unlikeable, so I'm going to work on getting a happy medium.
I'm taking out a lot of the beats, unless it's specifically for a gag - stuff like phone calls will obviously have beats in, I don't need to put them in..
There is a missing gag with the picture - I felt it was kind of a gag in its self, people always look at a chair, or a shirt and say it reminds them of someone, but this is a picture of them - of course it would remind them of the person! But I agree, I could do more with it.
The thing with the fingers is VERY specific to me and my friends, so I felt the need to explain it, it felt like a very vague mime - I didn't think anyone would understand what I meant without the extra words, but apparently not! I'll work on making it a bit more concise, if I keep it in - its not in the newest draft, a lot of stuff isn't actually..
There's a few things I could do to emphasise Dan feeling uncomfortable around the youths, I guess. Kids these days are very colourful as well, aren't they? they could stick out because of the dull clothing or something.. I'll have a think.
Anyway, thanks for your feedback, it's much appreciated - I've had a lot more constructive stuff from this forum than anywhere else, so that's great. I'm just happy no one seems to totally hate it thus far - I've noticed this forum can be quite harsh if something's a bit shit..
Thanks man!
The webfilters at work stop me reading it - I'll try to remember to do so when I get home. From the posts, it certainly sounds interesting and I like the premise.
What I will say is that the whole 'availability and cost of polaroid film' discussion seems a bit odd. I'm no expert but I believe that people in the TV and film business often use things called 'props' which can look like things without actually having to be that thing.
Quote: Afinkawan @ April 20 2010, 12:29 PM BSTThe webfilters at work stop me reading it - I'll try to remember to do so when I get home. From the posts, it certainly sounds interesting and I like the premise.
What I will say is that the whole 'availability and cost of polaroid film' discussion seems a bit odd. I'm no expert but I believe that people in the TV and film business often use things called 'props' which can look like things without actually having to be that thing.
So someone in the props department has to build something that looks like a Polaroid camera and then behaves just like one, taking a photo and printing it out immediately and then it develops in your hand. I'm not sure that's going to be a cheaper alternative.
Quote: Marc P @ April 20 2010, 1:21 PM BSTSo someone in the props department has to build something that looks like a Polaroid camera and then behaves just like one, taking a photo and printing it out immediately and then it develops in your hand. I'm not sure that's going to be a cheaper alternative.
Now, now - lets not start this again..
A sitcom gag can be just like a polaroid photo and suffer from too much exposure!
Been reworking the opening scenes, trying out some new things - not sure if I like it yet, there's something about most of the new dialogue that doesn't feel right, but I've not been working on it long.. anyway, have a look-see if you fancy..
FADE IN
PLAYGROUND - MORNING
A group of five and six year old children come running through the school gates making noise and shouting.
CLOSE UP
DAN YOUNG (late twenties) His eyes open, saliva has dried around his mouth. We pull back - he is underneath a jungle gym, which kids have started climbing on and banging noisily.
Dan sits up quickly and children reach through the bars and pull his hair and poke his face.
Several half empty cans of strong lager roll out from under him, and into the hands of the playing children.
Dan, still dazed pats himself down and finds his packet of cigarettes in his jacket pocket, pops one in his mouth and lights it. He turns to one of the kids, a BOY
DAN
It's hard isn't it? Keeping a relationship going. You can put all your efforts into it, y'know, give it 110 per cent but in the end it doesn't matter, it's all pointless. What's your name?
BOY
James.
DAN
James. Hi, I'm Dan. It was going so well, James - we were happy, I thought so any way. But that's when things go wrong isn't it? When things are at their best.
He hold out his cigarettes, offering the child one, but withdraws his offer before the child can decide.
DAN
All that time, all that money and emotional investment and before you know it your sat under a jungle gym talking to a little kid about how shit everything is. Could be worse, I suppose. I could be watching you from a distance.
The boy continues playing innocently.
DAN
Do you have a girlfriend, James?
JAMES
Girls smell!
DAN
Exactly. Don't you ever forget that, either. Girls do smell.
JAMES
Of poo and wee!
DAN
Spot on, matey - just keep that up, you'll live a long and happy life. Trust me.
The child laughs. Dan sighs.
JAMES
What's wrong?
DAN
How long have you got?
A TEACHER comes out into the playground ringing a bell and calling for the children.
DAN
Shit!
The teacher sees the children playing with beer cans and Dan smoking under the jungle gym.
TEACHER
Excuse me? Excuse me!
Dan turns around - the teacher is AMY, his Ex.
DAN
Amy! Hi - oh, don't mind me, we're just... We're having a little heart to heart - a chat, we're chatting. Hi.
TEACHER
I can't begin to describe how inappropriate this is. Where are your trousers?
DAN
On the slide, I think. Should I? ...I'll go get them.
(to James)
See you later James.
TEACHER
Dan - if you do this again, I'm going to have to phone the police. This is a bad thing - you can't be half naked in a playground
DAN
Half naked - I'm wearing pants, Amy, God, you make it sound so sinister!
AMY
That's because it is sinister!
DAN
Look, there's a reason I'm here. Maybe if I could remember where you lived, I'd have gone there, but the point is, this is your fault. You dumped me, remember? This is your doing. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go get my trousers off that childs slide, and leave here with my dignity in tact. Goodbye.
CUT TO:
INT. OFFICE - DAY
ELLIE (twenties) is sat at a desk wearing a headset in a small office cubicle.
She has short dark hair, fair skin and attractive, soft features. Although we can't yet hear her, it's clear she is in the midst of a personal crisis - arms flailing, hands gesturing angrily.
She is sobbing, trying to keep her voice down.
ELLIE
(crying, angry)
No you listen to me! It's, it's just not that easy alright!?
Look, don't be like that, acting like we're best friends all of a sudden!
(shocked)
Uh, you don't even know me!..
Not a f**king word, she just left!
Oh, don't start - you don't know what it's like!
She coughs.
ELLIE
Stop trying to make this about you!
Hey, you don't need to tell me about my responsibilities. Look, volunteers have bad days too you
know. Well, I'm sorry but--
We see the name of the company she is volunteering with:
"SAMARITANS"
ELLIE
Oh stop moaning! What I wouldn't give to be molested right now - count yourself lucky! Rape is still sex!
She hangs up pressing a button on the phone, sniffs her nose and composes herself.
The phone rings.
ELLIE
(sighing)
Samaritans - what's your problem?
CUT TO:
EXT. BAR - DAY
Dan and Ellie are halfway through their drinks in the beer garden of a trendy bar packed with brightly dressed teens. Amidst the crowd of youngsters they look old, grey and weathered, despite their youth.
We join them mid-conversation.
ELLIE
There's no way you can spin that to make it sound good. I'm surprised she didn't phone the police. You need a distraction, something to do instead of all this - this mopey, depressed business.
DAN
Like what?
ELLIE
I don't know! Collect stamps, start exercising, learn an instrument - The Bassoon! It's got a good name, it looks amazing and it probably sounds awesome, too.
DAN
Don't think so.
ELLIE
Well get thinking - I'm not living with some zombie half-person, it's gross. Like living with a disabled person. You just sit there, staring at things and moaning. Look at me, I lost Jen last week, you don't see me having a breakdown.
We hear a faint echo of her Samaritans meltdown.
DAN
I'll think of something.
ELLIE
Good, otherwise I'm getting you a wheelchair, and you can live like a proper spazz.
DAN
OK, OK.
He forces a smile.
DAN
See? See, I'm happy.
He drops the smile and searches for something to say.
DAN
We could go out.
ELLIE
What?
DAN
I'm serious.
ELLIE
I'm gay, Dan!
DAN
What, still? Haven't you grown out of that yet?
ELLIE
How long have you known me?
DAN
Like... five years?
ELLIE
And for how many of those years have I liked girls?
DAN
...Five.
ELLIE
Exactly. It's not like suddenly getting into punk, or taking up photography... or being vegan - it's not some phase! Dan, I love you but you nor any man is enough to make me stop fancying girls. Have you seen girls? They're great!
DAN
Yeah, they are good aren't they? Not that I'm having much luck with them.
ELLIE
You could try hopping over to the dark side?
DAN
Thanks, Ellie but as you pointed out, men aren't very attractive...
Dan stands up and puts his coat on.
ELLIE
You going?
DAN
Yeah, I think so, wouldn't want to cramp your style - I think that girl's checking you out.
Ellie turns to see a large manly woman with spiky short hair and a sleeveless checkered shirt looking her way.
ELLIE
(scared)
Oh God!
DAN
Yeah, good luck with that.
Dan glugs the rest of his drink, Ellen sighs.
ELLIE
OK then, see you later. Cheer up, misery guts!
Dan leaves.
Day turns to night and Dan is walking aimlessly around town.
If you like the polaroid couldn't you just hang a lantern on it? Point out how weird/expensive it is to have a polaroid camera, make a joke about it and kill two birds with one stone
I feel like unless I get rid of the stupid Polaroid, people aren't going to stop talking about it, and I won't get the feedback I need. So it's gone. There.
Just thought of something - a lot of the things said on here are to do with writing something that will get made - don't put silly expensive things in it etc.. If each of my episodes was based one a book, would it require purchasing the rights to each book? If so, I'm imagining this would be expensive, and off-putting to a prodcomp, right?
So, for those that have read the draft - should I, revert back to my original idea, which was just to have them experience 'stuff' good stuff, and right a book about it? Would this be as interesting? I feel it would free me up a bit not working within the constraints of a book..whatchoo think?
Quote: maffew @ April 20 2010, 11:02 PM BSTI feel like unless I get rid of the stupid Polaroid, people aren't going to stop talking about it, and I won't get the feedback I need. So it's gone. There.
Lady Gaga has saved you Matthew! You've been hip all along!
Quote: maffew @ April 24 2010, 11:26 PM BSTJust thought of something - a lot of the things said on here are to do with writing something that will get made - don't put silly expensive things in it etc.. If each of my episodes was based one a book, would it require purchasing the rights to each book? If so, I'm imagining this would be expensive, and off-putting to a prodcomp, right?
So, for those that have read the draft - should I, revert back to my original idea, which was just to have them experience 'stuff' good stuff, and right a book about it? Would this be as interesting? I feel it would free me up a bit not working within the constraints of a book..whatchoo think?
It's okay to refer to stuff in books if you are not quoting directly or lifting material. And if they are old enough will be out of copyright anyway.
You could have one featuring Hard Evidence and he could go round murdering prostitutes. And you can always ask permission to use stuff. Johnny Cash's estate has kindly let me use stuff.
someone mentioned that you don't need to instruct an actor to pause.
Pause for actors is shown by six elipses.
so it would be something like....
Jon
You look......amazing......have you been dieting?
etc, etc. Otherwise the actor will say it without a pause.
Quote: bushbaby @ April 29 2010, 3:13 PM BSTsomeone mentioned that you don't need to instruct an actor to pause.
Pause for actors is shown by six elipses.
so it would be something like....Jon
You look......amazing......have you been dieting?etc, etc. Otherwise the actor will say it without a pause.
You look......amazing. Have you been dieting?