All this talk of 'splitting kids' is turning me on.
General Election 2010 Page 42
Quote: Badge @ April 19 2010, 12:04 AM BSTUmmm.. what?
I was making a flippant aside to zooo.
I know it was a flippant aside, but you didn't really respond to zooo's point. That was kind of confirmed by her response to me. I was just trying to understand your argument, not rile you in any way Badge.
Quote: Badge @ April 19 2010, 12:04 AM BSTAnyway, my point about grammar schools is not that not-so bright kids suffer but that bright kids who don't get into the grammar school suffer. And there's a whole load of reasons for that that I won't go into (but partly because the two-tier system creams off the "best" teachers). And before you say it, I know we have a two tier system now anyway - I don't like that either.
I agree with this. You cannot possibly decide who should go to a 'better' school based on one exam at aged eleven. It's too easily influenced anyway. The majority of people at grammar schools I knew were tutored (including myself) or attended private schools and generally geared towards passing that specific exam. There's no real effective method of splitting kids up in accordance with 'ability'.
For what it's worth in my perfect education system people would be assigned schools rather than this ridiculous middle-class scramble to get places in certain schools. The silly market style system which is designed to promote competition amongst schools is responsible for a lot of the problems with certain schools appearing better than others.
Quote: Badge @ April 19 2010, 12:04 AM BSTUmmm.. what?
I was making a flippant aside to zooo.
Anyway, my point about grammar schools is not that not-so bright kids suffer but that bright kids who don't get into the grammar school suffer. And there's a whole load of reasons for that that I won't go into (but partly because the two-tier system creams off the "best" teachers). And before you say it, I know we have a two tier system now anyway - I don't like that either.
And finally - because I don't want to go on and on about Badge politics - I wish we could stop judging schools on the "brightness" of kids and accept that a good schooling can give people a lot of great experiences that can't be measured in exams or how f**king "bright" someone thinks they are.
Yeah, school gave me a lot of "great experiences". The teaching was great, even if I had to fight to make sure I didn't get stuck with crap teachers, and if I seemingly wasn't bright enough to get into selective schools then it was their loss. What I hate now is when one of my friends, for instance, says "Did you really go to a comprehensive school? You don't sound like you did...". Having said all that, a grammar school would have killed me by being so competitive I think, even if the comprehensive killed me a bit with the bullying.
Oh, I'm not trying to be mean either. 
Sorry, Badge.
Quote: zooo @ April 18 2010, 11:49 PM BSTOoh, what's a bear?
In the personal columns it is a hairy gay man. I can see why this might have been traumatic for keewik's son.
I didn't think anyone was trying to rile me. Even the bright young things of the BCG!
Quote: PhQnix @ April 19 2010, 12:15 AM BSTFor what it's worth in my perfect education system people would be assigned schools rather than this ridiculous middle-class scramble to get places in certain schools. The silly market style system which is designed to promote competition amongst schools is responsible for a lot of the problems with certain schools appearing better than others.
Amen to that brother. Parental choice is one of the biggest disasters ever invented by people to ruin our education system (just as giving patients choice is a disaster for the NHS). It isn't even choice anyway, but the illusion of choice.
Quote: Badge @ April 19 2010, 12:24 AM BSTAmen to that brother. Parental choice is one of the biggest disasters ever invented by people to ruin our education system (just as giving patients choice is a disaster for the NHS). It isn't even choice anyway, but the illusion of choice.
Absolutely. Choice is supposed to drive up standards. All it does is confuse, discriminate and disappoint. If half the resources that go into facilitating choice (or the illusion thereof) went into improving service, that would drive up standards a whole lot more efficiently.
Quote: Badge @ April 19 2010, 12:04 AM BSTthe two-tier system creams off the "best" teachers
If that weren't a myth propagated by opponents to a selective system, I would be far better off.
Quote: keewik @ April 19 2010, 12:01 AM BSTI try not to hurl chairs at the TV when her husband comes on to pontificate about education (not that I'm a violent person!)
You really must PM me who.
Quote: Aaron @ April 19 2010, 1:14 AM BSTIf that weren't a myth propagated by opponents to a selective system, I would be far better off.
Ha! I just realised I said was talking about "creaming off" teachers.
*sniggers*
Quote: Timbo @ April 19 2010, 12:20 AM BSTIn the personal columns it is a hairy gay man. I can see why this might have been traumatic for keewik's son.
If you told a Glasgow 'bear' that one, you might wake up three days later!
Quote: PhQnix @ April 19 2010, 12:15 AM BSTFor what it's worth in my perfect education system people would be assigned schools rather than this ridiculous middle-class scramble to get places in certain schools. The silly market style system which is designed to promote competition amongst schools is responsible for a lot of the problems with certain schools appearing better than others.
Couldn't agree more. It's also producing vast amounts of red tape, thereby costing us money, because parents start taking local authorities to Court if they can't get their child into their school of choice. There have been quite a number of such cases around here recently.
Quote: Aaron @ April 19 2010, 1:14 AM BSTIf that weren't a myth propagated by opponents to a selective system, I would be far better off.
You really must PM me who.
I could do, but you'd never have heard of him as it's the Scottish education scene he's in.
Damn.
Back to the election... Will calling in the Navy be seen as 'decisive action' by El Gordo (first time for everything) and boost his poll chances?
Quote: Aaron @ April 19 2010, 3:25 PM BSTBack to the election... Will calling in the Navy be seen as 'decisive action' by El Gordo (first time for everything) and boost his poll chances?
Of course it's electioneering but the Tories are saying it was their idea in the first place. I'm surprised Dave isn't leading a Dan Snow-like charge across the Channel himself.
Quote: Aaron @ April 19 2010, 3:25 PM BSTDamn.
Back to the election... Will calling in the Navy be seen as 'decisive action' by El Gordo (first time for everything) and boost his poll chances?
I guess that's the intention by look who he's got to announce it: LORD Mandelson, LORD Adonis and LORD West. So much for the egalitarian Labour party, the country's now being run by unelected appointees.
Brown missed an opportunity to make a drama out of this crisis earlier. He could have made himself look all decisive and 'on the ball', but now that the airports are reopening, it looks like too little too late.
Seems like an odd one.
Who gets to go with the Navy for free and who has to fork out the pounds for eurostar?