Frankie Boyle - Glad To See The Back Of Him?

So Frankie Boyle is in trouble again, but this time I really think he hasn't got much of a defence...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/apr/08/frankie-boyle-downs-syndrome

or

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1264725/Comedian-Frankie-Boyle-confronted-mocking-Downs-syndrome-victims.html

Boyle has talked about his plans to quit stand up and, in my view, that is probably no bad thing.

Personally I don't think that the defence of "it's only jokes" or "comedians should be able to tackle any subject" rings true in the case of guys like Boyle. Yes, of course, comics should be able to talk and make jokes about any subject. However, let's not pretend that Frankie Boyle serves some higher purpose. Unlike other comics he doesn't make jokes about taboo subjects in order to highlight hypocrisy or make any kind of intellectual point...

The man just seems to like making nasty jokes about people based on the most ignorant of stereotypes. So while he must, of course, have the right to say such things, I personally don't see any reason he should be applauded, encouraged or defended for the manner in which he goes about it.

Frankie Boyle has always struck me as a massively bitter person, comedically hitting out as a coping mechanism. His comedy is of the playground - nasty, shallow and spiteful... and intellectually negligible. So personally I'll be glad to see the back of him (and any other comics who follow his, frankly cowardly, formula for success). His is not a massive talent - to be honest, any comedian worth his/her salt could come up with funny jokes about the physically or mentally disabled, paedophiles, rapists etc. Making these kind of jokes isn't a sign of bravery, quite the opposite in fact.

He has such a massive fanbase though, why? Are the public sick and he's just pandering to that?

Quote: Ben @ April 9 2010, 11:28 AM BST

He has such a massive fanbase though, why? Are the public sick and he's just pandering to that?

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People like laughing at others, especially if it's something nasty. I often lay awake at night, giggling at the thought of your death Ben.

Personally, I don't like Boyle's act; it's empty.

Quote: Matthew Stott @ April 9 2010, 11:36 AM BST

People like laughing at others, especially if it's something nasty. I often lay awake at night, giggling at the thought of your death Ben.

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I'm going to touch you where your Uncle never stopped touching.

Quote: Ben @ April 9 2010, 11:28 AM BST

He has such a massive fanbase though, why? Are the public sick and he's just pandering to that?

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He has a massive fanbase because he is actually funny. And this is stupid, I've seen a fair few comedians take the mick out of downs syndrome, in fact Frankie Boyle may have been one of them when I went to see him a few years ago. You know what to expect when you go to see him, and I bet she was laughing at all the other offensive jokes he made without a seconds thought. The only bit I disliked in that story was when after picking on them for talking and her explaining about her daughter he said "It's true though isn't it", him of all people must know he's exaggerating for comedic effect? Anyway, this won't be the end of him and you'd have to be pretty naive to think so, his appeal is that he says whatever he wants and this will only enhance it, despite any efforts from the Daily Mail.

If Bernard Manning was unknown starting his career right now, he could and would use exactly the same defence as Boyle. I don't see any significant difference between their acts. The defence of "Well, obviously Frankie doesn't really mean what he says" is not a defence at all. How can one tell? If Bernard Manning had always denied the idea he was a racist, merely that he was being "ironic", he'd apparently have to be taken at his word.

Lest anyone think this is just a dig a Frankie Boyle (though he is the worst offender), there is a whole breed of stand up that sell nasty and cheap gags whilst hiding behind the whole "irony" and "freedom of speech" defence. Parts of Ricky Gervais' stand up, for example, don't really bear scrutiny on these issues.

I have said for a long time that I find his comedy distasteful and just down right disgusting really.

I certainly wouldn't miss him, and I don't miss him on Mock the Week either.

Quote: Mickeza @ April 9 2010, 11:39 AM BST

You know what to expect when you go to see him, and I bet she was laughing at all the other offensive jokes he made without a seconds thought.

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As I say, the 'Bernard Manning Defence'. Yeah, they're only jokes...

If he's such a brilliant comedian, then perhaps he should demonstrate this by producing an hour's worth of material which doesn't target minorities and stereotypes?

Quote: Mickeza @ April 9 2010, 11:39 AM BST

He has a massive fanbase because he is actually funny.

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When Mock The Weak first started, I thought he was pretty funny; in short bursts like that he was anyway, over the length of an actual set, I just found him boring. Not to my taste.

Frankie Boyle strikes me as being the kind of act who creates comedy for people who have, essentially, no moral centre.

There's a lot of great material out there, found offensive by some, Python, Brass Eye, Stewart Lee, creators who all are able to produce such work, because they are working from intelligence and a genuine viewpoint, rather than just kneejerk playground bullying. Frankie Boyle's humour seems to be aimed at people who haven't really grown.

Quote: Tim Walker @ April 9 2010, 11:42 AM BST

As I say, the 'Bernard Manning Defence'. Yeah, they're only jokes...

If he's such a brilliant comedian, then perhaps he should demonstrate this by producing an hour's worth of material which doesn't target minorities and stereotypes?

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I've never said he's a brilliant comedian, he was crap when I went to see him, but he is funny. And why would he come up with that set? His audience expect a certain something from him and boy does he give it to them. It'd be like tuning into an episode of The X-Factor and seeing Cowell recite Shakespeare for an hour. He wasn't always the way he is, in the earlier Mock The Week episodes he was pretty tame and more observant based, but he hit on a formula many people enjoy, and if you go and see him at one of HIS LIVE shows, and presumably you find all the other sick things about Madelaine Mcann, Stephen Hawking e.t.c funny, then you're a complete hypocrite if you make a fuss when he says something you dislike because it is personal to you.

Quote: john lucas 101 @ April 9 2010, 11:49 AM BST

Frankie Boyle strikes me as being the kind of act who creates comedy for people who have, essentially, no moral centre.

There's a lot of great material out there, found offensive by some, Python, Brass Eye, Stewart Lee, creators who all are able to produce such work, because they are working from intelligence and a genuine viewpoint, rather than just kneejerk playground bullying. Frankie Boyle's humour seems to be aimed at people who haven't really grown.

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Very much agree.

Quote: Mickeza @ April 9 2010, 11:53 AM BST

then you're a complete hypocrite if you make a fuss when he says something you dislike because it is personal to you.

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I posted the links as a reference point, but I didn't even mention the mother of the Down's syndrome child. Her actions and reactions are neither here nor there to me and were nothing to do with the points I was making.

I would also say that comedy is not the highest achievement known to Man. However much I might love comedy, laughs are not al that matters. They'll always be an audience for racist humour, sexist humour, homophobic humour. They'll always be people who will laugh at such things. All I'm saying is that the best comedians can get their laughs from any subject, but without doing so from a position of superiority. The very best can get these laughs whilst also making a serious point. Perhaps Frankie Boyle hates his audience, these braying idiots who laugh at his nasty jokes? If that is the case, I hope he lambastes them if and when he does pack stand up in.

Quote: Tim Walker @ April 9 2010, 11:25 AM BST

So Frankie Boyle is in trouble again, but this time I really think he hasn't got much of a defence...

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I think it was a touch more than a reference point, you clearly stated that this time he has no defence, and then linked to the story.

Without actually hearing any of the jokes he made, it's hard to comment effectively.

I do quite like very dark humour and tend to only really find it offensive when it is just lazy jokes playing to stereotypes - which is why I really don't like Bernard Manning and Jerry Sadowitz is about 50-50.

Having said that, surely by attending his gig and getting front row tickets, this couple at least condonded his style of humour, even if in this case they didn't like the content?

Quote: Mickeza @ April 9 2010, 12:01 PM BST

I think it was a touch more than a reference point, you clearly stated that this time he has no defence, and then linked to the story.

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The nature of the material, not the reaction of anyone in the audience. Apologies for the lack of clarity. If you would prefer me to be blunt and just say that I think people who go along to Boyle's gigs are morons and deserve what they get, then I will quite happily agree. I don't really care too much for the mother's distress, I care more for the way this kind of humour insidiously sanctions hate in society towards her daughter (who was not, I presume, in the audience).

Quote: Afinkawan @ April 9 2010, 12:02 PM BST

Jerry Sadowitz

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Jerry Sadowitz's act, however offensive to some, has a level of intelligence and awareness that Frankie Boyle doesn't even attempt to match.