Quote: z--- @ February 8 2010, 10:25 PM GMTWill the BBC discriminate when reading something that they receive to their writers room? Yes.... they'll discriminate against scripts that aren't funny.
Should that not be enough?
You'd think so wouldnt you? 
Quote: z--- @ February 8 2010, 10:25 PM GMTIf you're an able-bodied middle-class white man I wouldn't worry about missing out on this opportunity; it seems you've got a very good chance on getting on writing for TV and film as it is
I don't agree with that.
The comedy scene should be about being funny. I know many accountants... many of whom are white and none of them could ever get a spot writing/performing comedy because they are simply NOT funny.
There isn't any difference between the abilities of white/black/asian/disabled/women.
So why do they make it an issue? ....(still agree by Christopher Hitchens views on though)Will the BBC discriminate when reading something that they receive to their writers room? Yes.... they'll discriminate against scripts that aren't funny.
Should that not be enough?
So you don't agree that most comedy writers are male and white? Then you have to look at why that is.
This opportunity isn't the 'comedy scene'. It's one opportunity for someone who might not otherwise have the chance to get a script made.
The stand-up scene it is dominated by white middle and working class males. I know that some Asian and black stand-ups have had a very tough time in some gigs and women are particualrly worried about trying out stand-up. As for disabled comedians - there's so many gigs that they wouldn't even be able to get into. Now add to this that you're on a low income, have children to care for and/or a medical issue and you can begin to see that it's not neccesarily about being the funniest. It's about who can actually go out and gig several times a week for absolutely no money.
Similarly for writing, not many people from some of the backgrounds this opportunity is trying to reach, have the time or opportunity to get a script out there and noticed.
Thgis is about chances and encouraging people to come forward who otherwise might not, not discriminating against the people who will get their stuff seen and made anyway.
And what is all this business about the Writersroom? Why do people believe that TV comedy all comes through the Writersroom? In fact has any TV comedy come through the Writersroom?
Quote: Dolly Dagger @ February 9 2010, 8:37 AM GMTSo you don't agree that most comedy writers are male and white? Then you have to look at why that is.
This opportunity isn't the 'comedy scene'. It's one opportunity for someone who might not otherwise have the chance to get a script made.
The stand-up scene it is dominated by white middle and working class males. I know that some Asian and black stand-ups have had a very tough time in some gigs and women are particualrly worried about trying out stand-up. As for disabled comedians - there's so many gigs that they wouldn't even be able to get into. Now add to this that you're on a low income, have children to care for and/or a medical issue and you can begin to see that it's not neccesarily about being the funniest. It's about who can actually go out and gig several times a week for absolutely no money.
Similarly for writing, not many people from some of the backgrounds this opportunity is trying to reach, have the time or opportunity to get a script out there and noticed.
Thgis is about chances and encouraging people to come forward who otherwise might not, not discriminating against the people who will get their stuff seen and made anyway.
And what is all this business about the Writersroom? Why do people believe that TV comedy all comes through the Writersroom? In fact has any TV comedy come through the Writersroom?
Agreed.
BBC writers room is a point of reference. I don't think it's the only or even the best place to send anything - I just use it because everyone knows about it.
I completely agree. The stand up scene and the comedy writing scene are certainly dominated by white males. I'd be shocked if it wasn't. But I'd say that has more to do with numbers than anything else.
There are far more white people in Britain than non whites.
With all due respect...in my mind, if there were more/equal number of asian/black comedians and comedy writers/producers/directors than white... I would see that as massive inequality.
The fact that most are male, I put a lot of that down (predominantly) to desire. There are lots of women who want to get into/are in the comedy scene but I'll bet that there are many many more men who want to.
The fact that they are middle class... Most of my friends at school were middle class... Later on... many of them could actually be considered working class. For a start... half of them earn far more than I ever have and probably ever will...
but what I noticed was (clearly I can't speak for all of them) out of the ones that I knew/knew of.... many of them would not have been in the slightest bit interested in anything offered by the "Big 5 Comedy Award"
One of the people I've just been talking about inspired me to write a sitcom about exactly this.
Disabled people? I 100% agree that (as you say) they should make places more wheelchair friendly... I spent several months in a wheelchair and I know what its like trying to get into a shop with a step and having 2 shop keepers have to lift my chair over the step just to get in. It sucks... it's depressing so I can feel for them and totally agree there better wheelchair access is necessary.
WRT writing though and for the purposes of this site... comedy...I don't think it's as black and white as purely disabled and not disabled (I've written too much to go into it)
In the end...I completely disagree with any form of discrimination - whether it be down to sex, race, ability or religion.
As such... I think this too should be the same.... Concessions granted to those for whom it would be more difficult to get their entry in on time or don't have access to a computer/printer- yes of course.
But as a white male I don't like the way this has been done - and I feel stongly about it because it's not the 1st time for me - So yes I dare stand up for white males knowing it's still very taboo and controversial given the inequalities to date.
I know I'm opening myself up to persecution by people.. including white men - stupid or otherwise but it's my belief and my belief is... things should be equal... That includes oxbridge grads/Jews everyone.
I sincerely apologise that this has been such a long response... and there's a lot I didn't say but I've had my rant... so I'll now shut up.
PS This is the 1st time in 5 years I'VE had a chance to sit downs and write anything. 5 years ago, I did bits of stand up.. but I didn't have time. Yes I wanted to.. but I had to priotitise. It sucks... but as per Maslow's Hierarchy of needs, I needed the basics. Still do but now I've been made redundant and I've set aside time to do it.
"...it's my belief and my belief is... things should be equal..."
Yes. Never a truer sentiment, but life isn't like that hence the need for competitions such as The Big 5 to address this balance.
I work in Telly, comedy and entertainment development mainly, and have been a casual lurker on this forum for some time - but after reading your post I felt so compelled to sign up and tell you the reality of the situation.
One of the biggest ironies (I find) about this TV industry is that the majority of Execs don't think 'creatively' when hiring people - and this is meant to be a creative industry. Yeah, alright!
I've seen it time and time again: 'let's go with the safe option. Let's go with those who are 'proven'. Let's go for people that are like us; we must carry on taking everything and every one at face value but make out we're taking a risk - only with new ideas, though, never different people: let's hire people like US.'
Of course, they'd never admit it, but these facts/actions speak for themselves. In this month alone, the majority of writers I've noticed our Execs taking along to commissioner meetings - or just got in to have a 'chat' - have been middle/upper class, WHITE, males. Yes, there's your 'established', 'proven' females in there as well. In September we had two Asian, 'up and coming', female writers - oh and three black writers - two male, one female - come in during 2009. Actually, now I've typed it down, TV is addressing the equality balance, silly me.
I'm just looking around the office, a pretty typical indie from my experience, and it goes something like this: Four, white, middle-aged, middle-class white male Executives, two heads of development - white, middle-class, early 30's male. Four of these have been to Oxford and Cambridge. There are lots of pretty white, educated girls and boys at Researcher/ AP/ Co-ordinator level. Oh, but our cleaners are black.
Z---, just you being a white male statistically you have more chance of making it because of 'birds of a feather..', 'like attracts like (well, like hires like!) and all that...
"In the end...I completely disagree with any form of discrimination - whether it be down to sex, race, ability or religion."
Z---, this is life. This IS what's happening.
I'm not implying that this is intentional, most people in Telly would be mortified if you pointed it out to them (because they're pretty much good people), but when you've had a life full of 'privileges', unless you get out there and open your eyes and see firsthand the lives of those who haven't had aspirational and educational means, people are ignorant to the reality of discrimination - and that's understandable. These people are unlikely to know that there is indeed a problem.
Also, as mentioned in a previous post, if you're white and middle class, you're more likely to find the means to work for free while you pursue your craft/dream - you're more than likely got some one who's willing to support you. People from single parent, low earning backgrounds - not a chance.
Oh, and nepotism is rife in TV - but I can't be ranting about that now and boring you all to tears.
Thanks for clearing that up. TubbyTelly...
I think the Big 5 Award should, therefore address the issue by being equitable and not discriminating one way or the other.
And it is pretty obvious that the TV industry is full of discrimination..not just race...but sex and religion too.
From what you wrote, The only thing I thought different to what you said was that, where you say, like attracts like. I would have thought that that action was made easier by the fact that something like 85% (ish) of the population in Britain is white. (10 years ago.. maybe a little less now)
Also, believe me...saying that I completely disagree with any form of discrimination is 100% wishful thinking.
I'm not naive to the world and know that nepotism (and any other -ism) is rife but normally... (however pathetic the attempts) the powers that be try to deny everything.
I mean listen to the government every single day spouting tripe which everyone knows to be a pack of lies.
I get annoyed when instead of trying to hide it, we are told it. I say, keep us in blissful ignorance of what goes on behind closed doors.
Sounds like your company is addressing the issue.... (assuming they are hiring people on their merits and their merits alone)
Gives you a great opportunity to spread the word throughout the television fraternity.
Thanks for the reply
PS I'm currently living off my savings, not family.... which is why I have to find a temp job very soon.
PSS Everywhere I've worked, the cleaners have been white (many polish)... But Bristol hasn't seen as many black immigrants as somewhere like London. Actually... most jobs that used to be dominated by black immigrants (whether 1st or 2nd generation) are now predominantly eastern European. (1st gen) Here in Bristol at least.
You haven't read a thing have you? You really don't grasp whats been said or whats going on.
Quote: z--- @ February 11 2010, 12:37 AM GMTFrom what you wrote, The only thing I thought different to what you said was that, where you say, like attracts like. I would have thought that that action was made easier by the fact that something like 85% (ish) of the population in Britain is white. (10 years ago.. maybe a little less now)
I imagine at least 85% of the entrants to this will be white. Happy now?
Quote: z--- @ February 11 2010, 12:37 AM GMTPS I'm currently living off my savings, not family.... which is why I have to find a temp job very soon.
PSS Everywhere I've worked, the cleaners have been white (many polish)... But Bristol hasn't seen as many black immigrants as somewhere like London. Actually... most jobs that used to be dominated by black immigrants (whether 1st or 2nd generation) are now predominantly eastern European. (1st gen) Here in Bristol at least.
That's nice tht you're living off your savings but try not to spend it all at once eh.'
What does your last paragraph even mean? So what if the cleaners and butlers in your neck of the woods are white? what the f**k has that got to do with whats being talked about here?
Quote: z--- @ February 11 2010, 12:37 AM GMTPS I'm currently living off my savings, not family.... which is why I have to find a temp job very soon.
PSS Everywhere I've worked, the cleaners have been white (many polish)... But Bristol hasn't seen as many black immigrants as somewhere like London. Actually... most jobs that used to be dominated by black immigrants (whether 1st or 2nd generation) are now predominantly eastern European. (1st gen) Here in Bristol at least.
You are therefore very fortunate to be able to live off savings. Well done.
Bristol is a very isolated 'city' which certainly isn't representative of the UK.
From what I gather, unless you have had sole credit for a TV show or film, you are eligiable to enter this, so I don't know why you're so riled. On that basis the only person who posts on this forum who wouldn't be able to enter would be marc p. So it discriminates against Marc P, aka Lord Snooty - is that such a bad thing? 
Quote: Dolly Dagger @ February 11 2010, 8:14 AM GMTOn that basis the only person who posts on this forum who wouldn't be able to enter would be marc p. So it discriminates against Marc P, aka Lord Snooty - is that such a bad thing?
He does only come here to strut and preen, like a peacock. 
Thanks for the replies
No.. I grasp it perfectly well... Maybe some of the things I've said haven't been taken the right way..or I've missed some stuff out/explained myself badly.(not easy to put tone of voice on a post)
The last paragraph was in response to the previous message re: TubbyTelly's post.
85% is just a stat I used.... I'm neither happy nor sad about it.
Savings are only there after a few years of working.... it's not very impressive.. believe me.
And I'm not riled... I just get carried away with talking sometimes... my girlfriend says I can entertain myself for hours just talking to myself.
My last post was just responding to the previous post. That's all.
Oh don't worry about it. Are you going to write something then?
Hmmm.............. Naaah..... can't be arsed.
Just kidding.. I have...
Glad to hear it. Just send it off and act all confused if the time arrives for them to meet you.