Not Going Out - Series 2 Page 24

Quote: Krenz @ October 14, 2007, 10:03 PM

I thanyew.

Sorry, I'm about ten pages behind on this thread. Anyway glad to see the show is overall generally well-received (I'm one of the co-writers on it). And the criticisms are valid ones, though it's odd how everyone differs so much - I have friends who love the cleaner character and just laugh whenever she appears, and others who don't quite click with her. And some prefer Lucy to Kate, some don't...

Either way it's a show that I'm very pleased with for the gag-rate - that's what I think will always distinguish it from others who are happy with 2-3 laughs a page instead of 6-7 as Lee insists on. It's a good discipline, because after all, it's a comedy, and that's meant to make people laugh above all else.

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Hey, we're spoiling you now! Two writers off the programme reading your comments! (I agree with Krenz, it's amazing how different people's reactions are to Barbara. The one thing that comes through though, is that people love Tim! Coming through loud and clear . . . )

Quote: ContainsNuts @ October 15, 2007, 9:39 AM

I can't see a negative in being moved by something. Would you watch a drama and would rather it didn't make you laugh a few times? I don't think either should stick rigidly to one. But anyway, I think its a bonus if you are pleasantly moved by a sitcom or anything but I'm not saying being moved is a requirement. I think a bit of drama is - IMHO, and I think that's why the classics are so. That's all.

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I speak dispassionately now, as I wasn't at any of the recordings and feel slightly disconnected from this series and thus more of a "viewer", but I personally find the high gag-rate actually very useful for occasionally dropping in a moment of tenderness. Whenever Lee is caught short by something either Kate or Lucy says, and for a second he stops making wisecracks, I find that extrememly effective, and affecting. (Since he's too busy to read internet forums, I think I can say without embarrassment that his performance in this series has been even better than the first, and I really mean in those rare moments of drama.)

Oh, also, I hope Daisy didn't just come across as "thick." I was involved in developing her character in an early draft, and I deliberately made her indecisive, rather than just dim, hence the Magnum/Cornetto conundrum and the wine list gags. I thought she acted this very well.

i didn't think daisy was thick. she was great. she was more than indecisive though - e.g. the scene where she dumps lee and she says that she can't wait for two years. and the scene where she explained lucy's joke back to her. she was like lots of people you meet who just fail to spot a joke. irritatingly, and often embarrassingly.
the daisy part was acted very well.
oh, and i really like the music.

I wasn't referring to NGO in my comments as I appreciate its a unique vehicle of highly-gagged comedy. You have two stand-ups that deliver the gags better anyone - no doubt.

Maybe some people miss the tenderness as its difficult to see people you've seen do stand-up for years be dramatic out of the blue.

I probably should have started my own forum about what people loved about their favourite sitcoms etc as I can understand it looks like I'm talking about NGO despite my disclaimers.

Quote: ContainsNuts @ October 14, 2007, 11:20 PM

I don't think a sitcom should be entirely focus on just making people laugh above all else.

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I would agree with this.

Certainly being funny is the most important thing for a show like NGO but I also think that the show should be fun as well. I definitely think that the best eps of this series are the ones that have combined humour with entertaining situations. The weakest episodes are the ones which have contained a lot of Lucy and Guy's relationship as even when the jokes are good, they still aren't the sort of characters who are that enjoyable to watch.

Quote: Andrew Collins @ October 15, 2007, 10:49 AM

I personally find the high gag-rate actually very useful for occasionally dropping in a moment of tenderness. Whenever Lee is caught short by something either Kate or Lucy says, and for a second he stops making wisecracks, I find that extrememly effective, and affecting.

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I totally agree. I felt a great example of this was seen in Fridays episode when Lucy is trying to get Lee to practice his chat up lines on her. He started off with the jokes regarding buying her a lemonade in an expensive cocktail bar and then the joke about the lights in the place when she said her name was Bobby and then the gags stopped and suddenly their relationship takes another turn and this was definatly a tender moment when Lee risks showing, what are perhaps, his true feelings. Then of course, the gags return, after having been laughed at by Lucy.

I loved this part as I felt it added a layer to their relationship and helped me warm to Lucys character more as now I feel I want to see how her relationship develops with Lee (a character that is well established and I already care about) Although, as has been mentioned on here before, I hope they don't get together as I feel the conflict of possible unrequited love could prove highly comical.

I randomly commented to my housemate before it started that Id like to see Tim get together with the cleaner as I felt the two of them would be great on screen together. Five minutes later and there they are, having drinks! I enjoyed their scenes, but then I like the character of Barbara so Im sure that helped.

Quote: Quentin @ October 15, 2007, 11:26 AM

He started off with the jokes regarding buying her a lemonade in an expensive cocktail bar and then the joke about the lights in the place when she said her name was Bobby and then the gags stopped and suddenly their relationship takes another turn and this was definatly a tender moment when Lee risks showing, what are perhaps, his true feelings.

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That scene was great.

Quote: Andrew Collins @ October 15, 2007, 10:49 AM

Whenever Lee is caught short by something either Kate or Lucy says, and for a second he stops making wisecracks, I find that extrememly effective, and affecting.

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Yup. I love those scenes. NGO isn't just a gag machine, it does have moving moments too. I think it's pretty rare for a sitcom to manage both so well.

Can someone please explain technical stuff to me, like why is this show only 6 episodes per season, unlike American shows, which have 21-24 episodes/year? I really love this show and would like to watch more of it!

And one more thing, perhaps not related to the show itself: when I was in England, I couldn't find old Lee Mack or Tim Vine DVDs, and internet stores have them out of stock. I think this show would be a reason for Lee and Tim to reprint those DVDs (if they're OOP) and start selling them - I think there are more people out there interested in them!

Quote: pinkISH @ October 15, 2007, 2:26 PM

Can someone please explain technical stuff to me, like why is this show only 6 episodes per season, unlike American shows, which have 21-24 episodes/year? I really love this show and would like to watch more of it!

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British shows tend to run for 6 episodes as they usually have small writing teams unlike the football teams required to write American shows.

Quote: pinkISH @ October 15, 2007, 2:26 PM

And one more thing, perhaps not related to the show itself: when I was in England, I couldn't find old Lee Mack or Tim Vine DVDs, and internet stores have them out of stock. I think this show would be a reason for Lee and Tim to reprint those DVDs (if they're OOP) and start selling them - I think there are more people out there interested in them!

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Tim Vine's live DVD is available cheaply on ebay and Lee Mack's DVD might be was well.

Lee Mack's first stand-up DVD is coming out soon - November 26. You can pre-order from Play.com.
He's v.v. good live, so it should be excellent.

Check out our Upcoming Releases page.

In reply to pinkISH, as Nick says British shows have smaller writing teams, and IMO, generally pack far more character development, consistent funny, and more satisfying storylines into the 6 or so episodes than most American ones do in a whole season.

Quote: ContainsNuts @ October 15, 2007, 9:39 AM

Different horses for courses my friend. You are entitled to have your own definition. I thought we were agreeing that you need some drama to differentiate it from stand-up?

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Yes, it's needed, but my point is that IMO at least, the humour is far more important.

Quote: ContainsNuts @ October 15, 2007, 9:39 AM

I can't see a negative in being moved by something. Would you watch a drama and would rather it didn't make you laugh a few times? I don't think either should stick rigidly to one. But anyway, I think its a bonus if you are pleasantly moved by a sitcom or anything but I'm not saying being moved is a requirement. I think a bit of drama is - IMHO, and I think that's why the classics are so. That's all.

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Well, pretty much agreed there. I like the odd joke in Midsomer Murders, and of course a sitcom needs a story of some kind in order to carry the humour, but for me, ultimately I'm not really bothered about gaining anything more than a good laugh from a sitcom. Friday's NGO was great, however, and the manner in which Lee seemed to almost feel sorry for himself and be a bit dejected at times worked really well IMO. But I wouldn't really have missed that had it not been there. As long as there's jokes, I'm happy.

So I guess in answer, it's not so much a negative to be moved by a sitcom, but it's far from necessary. Or something. :-/

Having a smaller team also makes the characters more believable.

Instead of a laugh a half minute - ie just joke machines - we brits produce better real stories.

Quote: Aaron @ October 15, 2007, 5:29 PM

As long as there's jokes, I'm happy.

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When it comes to sitcoms, I am of the same opinion. I would not like NGO to drop the gags in favour of drama.

Enjoyed this week's - a real improvement on last week's slightly flatter outing, and the relationships have definitely moved on. Only downpoint for me was the inclusion of a Berlin Wall gag very similar to one that is (or was) in my unfinished sitcom pilot - grrr. Such is life! But I needn't worry unless mine ever gets made, so I will still sleep well tonight.

One question for the writers - was this first drafted before Kate left and Lucy was cast? Reason I ask is the absence of Guy and some of the banter/put downs from Lucy seemed a bit Kate-ish.

More plaudits to Lee too for a bit of poignancy in the "practice" chatting up scene.

That moment Lee had with Lucy was worth twenty jokes. Pathos. The best comedies have it in abundance and make you realise these are believable characters and not just one dimensional. We need more of this. Not all the time, but just to make us believe it's not a gag machine (which will be difficult with so many stand-ups involved).

Although I do have quibbles with the characters lacking depth, it remains very watchable. I've got to say though, one of the jokes used in last week's show was said by a classmate of mine at school in the 90's. And the set-up was better! The one used by the writers was too clunky.