Are there any tricks to getting a better punchline to a sketch?
Punchier punches
Quote: Nogget @ January 17 2010, 6:06 PM GMTAre there any tricks to getting a better punchline to a sketch?
Think of the punchline first then work backwards.
Sketches don't have to have punchlines, they just have to have endings. If you have a punchline then you are ok. If not just end at the most natural ending point as soon as possible after a big laugh.
Quote: Mr Snodworthy @ January 17 2010, 6:34 PM GMTThink of the punchline first then work backwards.
Do that and you don't have a sketch, you have a gag. It's not quite the same thing. In most sketches the big laugh comes before the halfway point, the rest is riffing on the idea while you frantically look for the exit.
You can work hard to polish one liners but I sometimes think you've either got the knack of writing them or you haven't.
Quote: Timbo @ January 17 2010, 7:08 PM GMTIn most sketches the big laugh comes before the halfway point, the rest is riffing on the idea while you frantically look for the exit.
I concur. Excluding my output, all the best sketches have the big laugh earlier then milk it until a nice neat out. Mine start with a smile then work their way down hill from there.
Firstly let me say that I'm more experienced in writing jokes rather than sketches but I presume there's some similarity in the two.
I'd suggest making sure that the "laugh" (the words that are going to get the laugh) is right at the end of the puncline (this sometimes means taking liberties with grammar) and also using as few words as you can possibly get away with in the set ups, that way it'll be punchy and with no flabby, unnecessary bits.
Basically it's all in the editing and re-writing.
Quote: Timbo @ January 17 2010, 7:08 PM GMTDo that and you don't have a sketch, you have a gag. It's not quite the same thing. In most sketches the big laugh comes before the halfway point, the rest is riffing on the idea while you frantically look for the exit.
Sketches are always stronger if they have a good out. (I hate the term "punchline", it makes the whole thing sound so "I say I say I say".)
You're talking about a recent trend in sketch shows, where there's a funny idea at the heart of the sketch but the writers don't seem to really care about the ending. They generally just sort of peter out at the end, which is more acceptable if if the sketch is a runner, but if it's a standalone, that's just rubbish IMO. So many sketch shows do this now that it's pretty-much accepted as the norm, and when you do get a really well-crafted sketch that has a big laugh at the end, where it's meant to be, it's usually quite the surprise.
I think sketches have always relied on a funny idea at the heart of the sketch rather than building to a punchline - take 'Forkhandles' for instance where the big laugh comes about 30 seconds in. A lot of Tow Ronnies sketches ended very weakly, and ducking the punchline entirely is not a new development, Monty Python devised the structure of the show with this mind, and Spike Milligan just used to have his characters wander off set mumbling, "What do we do now, whado we do now?".
Ideally the out should be neat and satisfying, but it should emerge organically from the sketch, rather than the sketch being built around the out, as you seemed to be implying.
Quote: Mr Snodworthy @ January 18 2010, 12:43 PM GMTSketches are always stronger if they have a good out.
Sketches are always stronger if they're funny, I don't think it matters if the funniest bit's in the middle or at the end. There should be no rules for how a sketch should be,because that leads to a lazy formula.
Quote: Tony Cowards @ January 18 2010, 10:33 AM GMTFirstly let me say that I'm more experienced in writing jokes rather than sketches but I presume there's some similarity in the two.
I'd suggest making sure that the "laugh" (the words that are going to get the laugh) is right at the end of the puncline (this sometimes means taking liberties with grammar) and also using as few words as you can possibly get away with in the set ups, that way it'll be punchy and with no flabby, unnecessary bits.
Basically it's all in the editing and re-writing.
Sound advice.
Reading them out loud helps me. Sometimes jokes on paper read funnier than how they actually sound.
Quote: Timbo @ January 18 2010, 1:46 PM GMTIdeally the out should be neat and satisfying, but it should emerge organically from the sketch, rather than the sketch being built around the out, as you seemed to be implying.
No the original poster asked how to make punchlines punchier,. and I suggested that as one way.
But I do think the endings to sketches are very important. You're absolutely right that a lot of the Ronnies sketches ended weakly - but there was so much fun to be had along the way that I don't suppose it really mattered. What I personally can't stand is a sketch that just fades to nothing at the end.
For instance an example of a great sketch (for me anyway) is Kevin Eldon's Dr Jekyll from Big Train. We get treated to all this hilarious mugging and spluttering after he takes a sip from the infernal potion, then at the end he turns to cam and says camply "Ooo, it is tart!" To my mind that sketch is just about perfect. Great performance, laughs all the way through, then the biggest laugh left till the end.
It's just my personal preference. For me it shows off real comedy-writing craft. Great outs are hard to do, so when I see one, it's refreshing and makes the sketch stick in my mind. 
I'm in agreement with that, Snodworthy. For me, even with the greats, I am left disappointed if they haven't saved at least a decent sized laugh for the end.
In saying that, most of mine end in "bugger", or "Bollocks". Cheap points, eh?