Surprise News - Police Officer Found Not Guilty Page 2

There seems to be plenty of publicity when the Police do something they apparently shouldn't have done (I'm speaking generally, not specifically) but little on the terrible conditions, circumstances and situations they face.

They are understaffed, under equipped and often not sufficiently trained for the job ie, Specials and Community Support Officers made to attend calls that they are not able to deal with and Beat Officers expected to do the jobs of Sergeants.

Sometimes they work back to back shifts (2 x 14 hours) because no one turns up to take over.

Following recent shake ups and changed of boundaries, they can be drafted anywhere and have no say in the matter.

A few weeks ago I witnessed the aftermath of a theft in Cambridge. A Community Support Officer was first on the scene. A gang of youths turned on him and he was pushed and shoved. He handled the situation extremely well, trying to calm down some hysterical and angry youths whilst also trying to defend himself and call for back up. When back up finally arrived most of them ran off.

Dealing with horrific situations is part of the job, but they no longer get support in dealing with the effects of the aftermath.

There was a complaint in the local press about an Officer who failed to attend the last few neighbourhood watch meetings and who cancelled a talk on road saftey at a local school. This was followed by many letters of agreement about how wrong and unacceptable this was. The Officer concerned was not allowed to publicly defend himself, but I know that he was drafted to a secret operation, as well as being expected to police a 90 mile radius. As he has said to me in the past; 'when the opportunity arises to catch ***** in the act, or you have a 999 call and you are the only one on duty, you really can't go and see Mrs Smith about the dog pooh on footpath 26, but when she complains publicly it does nothing for the force or the individual on the receiving end of the complaint.'

No wonder they have such a high level of stress related absence.

There are bad apples in every barrel. Let's salute the good ones.

Quote: Loopey @ November 5 2009, 12:10 PM GMT

A few weeks ago I witnessed the aftermath of a theft in Cambridge. A Community Support Officer was first on the scene. A gang of youths turned on him and he was pushed and shoved.

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Youths are horrible. We have the worst young people in the world now.

Quote: Loopey @ November 5 2009, 12:10 PM GMT

There are bad apples in every barrel. Let's salute the good ones.

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No-one is slating the police in general, I think, Loopey.

But ignoring or excusing unacceptable and, indeed, illegal, racist and violent behaviour by those "bad apples" is not the answer.

Do some research into completely avoidable deaths in police custody, which still occur year after year, where officers who have either contributed directly or indirectly to the deaths are at most given a slap on the wrists.

The fact remains that the complaints procedures and legal system operates in such a way that the odds of getting away with unacceptable/illegal behaviour is still massively stacked in the police's favour.

Quote: chipolata @ November 5 2009, 12:16 PM GMT

Youths are horrible. We have the worst young people in the world now.

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Aw, I know a few normal teens who are lovely. I don't know any who aren't.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ November 5 2009, 12:18 PM GMT

Aw, I know a few normal teens who are lovely. I don't know any who aren't.

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It's like Lord of the Flies on the streets of Britain. But without the conch.

Quote: Loopey @ November 5 2009, 12:10 PM GMT

There seems to be plenty of publicity when the Police do something they apparently shouldn't have done

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I'd argue it's exactly the opposite. Most of these cases are usually barely reported, if at all. Newspapers certainly don't ever run in-depth articles into them and columnists never touch them with a barge pole. (Except perhaps in the cases of alleged racist behaviour, but then it is usually only reported on in terms of internal disputes - i.e. officer versus officer.)

Drugs.

Quote: chipolata @ November 5 2009, 12:16 PM GMT

Youths are horrible. We have the worst young people in the world now.

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I hope not, I am mum to three youths!

Quote: Tim Walker @ November 5 2009, 12:20 PM GMT

I'd argue it's exactly the opposite. Most of these cases are usually barely reported, if at all. Newspapers certainly don't ever run in-depth articles into them and columnists never touch them with a barge pole. (Except perhaps in the cases of alleged racist behaviour, but then it is usually only reported on in terms of internal disputes - i.e. officer versus officer.)

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Well, I guess I must be more aware of them then, having friends and family in the force when things like this come to light it is usually pointed out to me and discussed in the circles I frequent so it seems like it happens often.

Quote: Tim Walker @ November 5 2009, 12:17 PM GMT

No-one is slating the police in general, I think, Loopey.

But ignoring or excusing unacceptable and, indeed, illegal, racist and violent behaviour by those "bad apples" is not the answer.

Do some research into completely avoidable deaths in police custody, which still occur year after year, where officers who have either contributed directly or indirectly to the deaths are at most given a slap on the wrists.

The fact remains that the complaints procedures and legal system operates in such a way that the odds of getting away with unacceptable/illegal behaviour is still massively stacked in the police's favour.

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I don't advocate ignoring it and am definitely not excusing it - just wanted to speak up for the other side, as it were. Two sides to every story and all that.

Quote: Loopey @ November 5 2009, 12:37 PM GMT

I don't advocate ignoring it and am definitely not excusing it - just wanted to speak up for the other side, as it were. Two sides to every story and all that.

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Of course. Though I don't see how issues relating to overtime and manpower issues really balances an argument about allegations of police brutality and racism. Every public servant has operational difficulties relating to their work, but it can't excuse taking it out on those they serve.

I am sure that there is a lot of truth in what you say Loopey, but as Tim says that in itself that would not excuse the officers involved of the offence of which they were accused. Institutions need to be held to account when they are at fault, regardless of their merits, or the difficulties they face. Only by acknowledging failings can you begin to address them, and if making the policeman's job easier, or managing public expectations, could contribute to that, that is something that, once the problem is out in the open, can be explored. Sweeping problems under the carpet just results in everyone being tarred with the same brush.

Over here, in small city USA, we have a problem with our police using their "I'll do anything I want" badge. We currently have a situation where a cop was beating up his wife, the neighbours called the police, his buddy was the first officer to respond, and when realizing just what was going on, he arrested the wife for endangering the welfare of a child. Now they're looking in to all sorts of cases to see what other things might have slipped by.

Quote: Tim Walker @ November 5 2009, 12:42 PM GMT

Of course. Though I don't see how issues relating to overtime and manpower issues really balances an argument about allegations of police brutality and racism. Every public servant has operational difficulties relating to their work, but it can't excuse taking it out on those they serve.

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Fair point. Of course there is no excuse for genuine cases of brutality and racism.
I can't go into details, but I was attempting to point out a different side of things without getting into a deep discussion about that particular issue.

There have been cases where because of overtime and manpower issues, a lone exhausted officer attending a violent situation finds himself accused of brutality or assault when he was actually defending himself.

Most frustrating, so much more I would like to say! I think I will bow out of this thread now before I get myself into trouble.

Quote: AndreaLynne @ November 5 2009, 12:52 PM GMT

Over here, in small city USA, we have a problem with our police using their "I'll do anything I want" badge. We currently have a situation where a cop was beating up his wife, the neighbours called the police, his buddy was the first officer to respond, and when realizing just what was going on, he arrested the wife for endangering the welfare of a child. Now they're looking in to all sorts of cases to see what other things might have slipped by.

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Dear oh dear oh dear.

Quote: Tim Walker @ November 5 2009, 1:06 PM GMT

Dear oh dear oh dear.

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And get this. The old friend of mine who's an officer that I was considering going on a date with is involved with a lot of this shifty stuff too. Oh well. Glad I found out in time.

Tough on criminals, tough on crooked cops. That's all I want.