Thanks, BB.
I think it's good stuff too, but then I'm hopelessly biased.
There have been some very astute points made, though, so maybe the pinnacle of perfection hasn't been reached yet. 
Stand Up (edited, improved and extended) Page 2
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 2:25 PM BSTDear BCGers,
I've had a few requests - most of which were physically impossible and some almost certainly illegal but others of which concerned the snippet of stand up I posted a while back.
Accordingly, here's the new, improved version.
It's only a short snippet and it's for performance by a very thin comedienne:
......................................................................................................................Hi, I'm (NAME).
I'm a comedian and aspiring comedy writer. If you're a regular 'attendee' (MIME QUOTES) at this sort of venue, you might remember my face. If you're a TV producer, you might remember the top of my head (LEAN FORWARD AND BACK).
I was at home last week when the phone rang. I was in the shower. I mention that for two reasons: one, it introduces suspense into the story. "Will she get to the phone before it stops ringing?", and two, it conjures up a picture in your minds of me in the shower . . . which some of you might find arousing. (LOOK AROUND THE AUDIENCE) (NOD AS IF REALISING) You were worrying I wouldn't get the phone in time, right?
It's not my fault I'm skinny. I'm the only girl in the world with two backs. I have a tattoo on my chest "In case of rape: this side up".
I stole that joke from a Jim Davidson DVD and I'm only repeating it in a postmodern ironic kind of way.
We shouldn't joke about rape. Rape is not funny. It's just not. Even when the guy wears a clown mask, it's still not funny.
One guy told me I have a 'function-specific anatomy'.
Look. I do impressions. (STAND SIDEWAYS, STICK TONGUE OUT) Can you tell what it is, yet? No, not Rolf Harris. That was an accidental impression. (STAND SIDEWAYS, STICK TONGUE OUT AGAIN) It's a zip! (WAIT A FEW SECONDS) Some people say it's a lesbian with an erection but those people are not very nice.
I've always been very thin. You think I'm thin now? You should have seen me when I was younger. When I was fourteen, I swallowed a grape and three of my cousins left town. No, that's not true. One of them got to the outskirts of town and then realised it couldn't be hers.
And before that, I was even thinner. I remember when I was 8 or 9 years old I used to go into town every weekend and just sit on the pavement all day begging like a little homeless skeleton. And my dad would sit in the pub opposite, looking after my shoes and watching through the window in case anyone tried to feed me.
Anyway, I was at home last week when the phone rang. I was in the shower and I did manage to pick it up before it stopped ringing. It was the BBC.
I accepted the charge and they said "Can you do three minutes on a new comedy show we're recording next week?" I said 'Yes, I'd love to".
"There's only one thing," they said. "We don't want anything gynaecological".
"But most of my act is about women's woes in one form or another", I said.
There was a pause and he said "No women's woes. No female stuff. Period!" and put the phone down without a trace of irony.
Don't you love unintentional comedy? I do - except when it's me that's doing it. It feel's like I'm working on my day off.
When my family found out I was going into comedy, they were mortified. My grandmother threw her hands in the air. That's a strange expression – 'throw your hands in the air', isn't it? I mean, how would you ever catch them when they came down again?
Anyway, my grandmother threw her hands in the air and emitted a wail – which is another good trick. Emitting a whale You think childbirth is uncomfortable? Try emitting a whale!
So, the whale's lying there, flapping around on the carpet, my grandmother's fainted and we've sent out for plankton . . .
I can see a few of you looking puzzled now. This is the surreal part of my act. Are they any Eddie Izzard fans here tonight? Well, guess what – he's not coming. So make the most of me.
Down deep in your heart, (I assume you have one ), I suspect that you aren't comfortable with the 'rape' reference yourself because of your 'apology' by way of:
"I stole that joke from a Jim Davidson DVD and I'm only repeating it in a postmodern ironic kind of way. We shouldn't joke about rape. Rape is not funny. It's just not. Even when the guy wears a clown mask, it's still not funny."
Also with the line, "Even when the guy wears a clown mask, it's still not funny." you are setting up the 'very thin comedienne' for heckling or worse - especially from women in the audience.
Yes, I know this was your plan 
- so you will have to anticipate likely heckles (as many stand-ups do) and write suitable 'comebacks'. But there again, if the performance is to be in a modern club such as 'The Comedy Store' or similar - the act won't get any further than: "In case of rape: this side up".
--- Unless of course your 'very thin comedienne' is performing at the like of a 'White Van Man/Lorry Drivers/Hard Hat' Convention - which of course was your alternative plan I suspect.
Quote: Morrace @ October 28 2009, 8:57 PM BSTDown deep in your heart, (I assume you have one
"I stole that joke from a Jim Davidson DVD and I'm only repeating it in a postmodern ironic kind of way. We shouldn't joke about rape. Rape is not funny. It's just not. Even when the guy wears a clown mask, it's still not funny."
Also with the line, "Even when the guy wears a clown mask, it's still not funny." you are setting the 'very thin comedienne' up for heckling or worse - especially from women in the audience.
Yes, I know this was your plan
--- Unless of course your 'very thin comedienne' is performing at the like of a 'White Van Man/Lorry Drivers/Hard Hat' Convention - which of course was your alternative plan I suspect.
Let me explain as best I can:
The first rape joke ('this side up') is, to my mind, a very dodgy joke indeed. It has comedic merit but its potential to offend women in the audience is very great indeed. My own view is that those women should be spared that offence so, in and of itself, therefore, it's not a joke a wise comedian should use unless performing to a stag audience.
The second rape joke ('the clown mask') has immense comedic merit but I simply do not have the time to explain why if people can't see what I mean: it's just too complicated. To my mind, whatever offence that joke may give is outweighed by its comedic merit.
The mid-joke apology-joke ('stolen from Jim Davidson') came to me after careful consideration of the advice given to me by people who read the script in its earlier form.
My view is that the above 3-joke combination is more funny than it is offensive and, for that reason, I think it should stay in the script.
Some people will say I should take out all references to rape, and I have great respect for that view even though I don't share it.
Believe me, I have zero respect for comedians who demonstrate contempt for any innocent-yet-oft-oppressed section of our society (women, children, blacks, Asians, the elderly, the mentally ill, the disabled, etc, etc). On the other hand, I believe it's possible sometimes to be extremely funny about all those subjects as long as the innocent-yet-oft-oppressed person in the joke is not being exposed to ridicule or contempt.
Neither I, nor any other comedian, will get it right all the time but, as long as we're worth our salt, we'll always try bloody hard not to get it wrong.
Comedy is a dangerous game: that's why it's so much fun.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTLet me explain as best I can:
The first rape joke ('this side up') is, to my mind, a very dodgy joke indeed. It has comedic merit but its potential to offend women in the audience is very great indeed. My own view is that those women should be spared that offence so, in and of itself, therefore, it's not a joke a wise comedian should use unless performing to a stag audience.
The second rape joke ('the clown mask') has immense comedic merit but I simply do not have the time to explain why if people can't see what I mean: it's just too complicated. To my mind, whatever offence that joke may give is outweighed by its comedic merit.
The mid-joke apology-joke ('stolen from Jim Davidson') came to me after careful consideration of the advice given to me by people who read the script in its earlier form.
My view is that the above 3-joke combination is more funny than it is offensive and, for that reason, I think it should stay in the script.
Some people will say I should take out all references to rape, and I have great respect for that view even though I don't share it.
Believe me, I have zero respect for comedians who demonstrate contempt for any innocent-yet-oft-oppressed section of our society (women, children, blacks, Asians, the elderly, the mentally ill, the disabled, etc, etc). On the other hand, I believe it's possible sometimes to be extremely funny about all those subjects as long as the innocent-yet-oft-oppressed person in the joke is not being exposed to ridicule or contempt.
Neither I, nor any other comedian, will get it right all the time but, as long as we're worth our salt, we'll always try bloody hard not to get it wrong.
Comedy is a dangerous game: that's why it's so much fun.
Yep, I anticipated correctly.
Quote: Morrace @ October 28 2009, 8:57 PM BST--- Unless of course your 'very thin comedienne' is performing at the like of a 'White Van Man/Lorry Drivers/Hard Hat' Convention - which of course was your alternative plan I suspect.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTMy own view is that those women should be spared that offence so, in and of itself, therefore, it's not a joke a wise comedian should use unless performing to a stag audience.
Best if you had stated at the outset, 'it's for performance by a very thin comedienne performing to a stag audience':
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTThe second rape joke ('the clown mask') has immense comedic merit but I simply do not have the time to explain why if people can't see what I mean: it's just too complicated. To my mind, whatever offence that joke may give is outweighed by its comedic merit.
May I refer you to your own wise words below, which also apply to your 'clown mask' gag.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 20 2009, 4:12 PM BSTTell that joke to 1000 people in a real-life stand-up situation and I'd be surprised if ANY of them get it.
Reading it on screen, it's easy to get the joke.
Hearing it in a pub/club is a very different story.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTMy view is that the above 3-joke combination is more funny than it is offensive and, for that reason, I think it should stay in the script.
This is 'Critique' (Hello!) - so in future, please state exactly (suggest you highlight in bold) which jokes, dialogue, directions you think should stay in any scripts you post because - well, as you yourself say...
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTI simply do not have the time
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTBelieve me, I have zero respect for comedians who demonstrate contempt for any innocent-yet-oft-oppressed section of our society (women, children, blacks, Asians, the elderly, the mentally ill, the disabled, etc, etc).
I'm the same - in fact I do a lot of charitable work for 'etc, etc' in particular.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTI believe it's possible sometimes to be extremely funny
You can be sometimes - as you proved in your 'Wedding Day' sketch (sadly deleted - it was funny, folks!).
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTNeither I, nor any other comedian, will get it right all the time but, as long as we're worth our salt, we'll always try bloody hard not to get it wrong.
*clenched fist in the air* (trying to make it look like I'm citicising 'the others' as well)
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 9:23 PM BSTComedy is a dangerous game: that's why it's so much fun.
You got that right!
Let me just clarify . . .
The 'this side up' joke, if told without the 'clown mask' joke, is in my view suitable only for a stag audience.
The two jokes told together (preferably with the 'stolen from JD' joke between them) are arguably close to the edge but are in my view suitable for a regular comedy-night mixed audience.
I enjoyed this - found it very easy to envisage it being performed.
Quote: Roodeye @ October 28 2009, 3:53 PM BSTThanks, Lee.
I have to say at this point before there's any confusion that I'm not a man, a woman, or anything else composed of flesh and blood.
I'm just an entity.
Can we forget all this pretentious 'entity' stuff? Those of us who've known you on the 'Last Laugh' board and on 'Comedy-Central-whatever-it-was-called' know full well you are male ... you have been seen and you have been heard. So you are a man making rape jokes.
That apart, I find it so sad you all think it's fine to make rape jokes at a stag 'do' (or anywhere else). Surely you realise rape isn't just a bit of slap and tickle with a bit of resistance from the victim - the rapist will piss on and in his victim and do God-knows what other kind of horrible things. Some victims commit suicide because they can't live with what's happened. I do realise comedy has to push the boundaries but I find it impossible to understand how rape jokes can ever be funny. I notice all but one of the posts here are by men. Think male rape. Think of some revolting bastard sticking his cock up your arse. Really think about it - it could happen to you as you walk along a street in the dark on your own. Really, really think about it and then decide if you think it's funny.
Apart from all that, I found the sketch quite boring except for the grape joke.
Aren't jokes about male rape - soap in the showers and all that - quite common?
I think they're quite mild - like 'don't turn your back on him?
But do you find them funny?
A bit tedious maybe, but not offensive (and having been goosed before now by 6'6" transvestite with hands like shovels, I am not insensitive to the general point your are making). I just felt that the gags in this piece of stand-up were of the same order of silliness, and therefore not in themselves offensive. There is nothing that seems to me advocate or excuse rape. Of course if there was someone in the audience who was suffering post-traumatic distress as a result of rape they might see it differently, but subjective reaction is a problem with a lot of themes used in comedy. Ultimately in deciding whether something is offensive you have to look at the material itself, not what nerves might be touched
Actually thinking about this a bit more, I suppose I am a little uncomfortable with that aspect of the material - and particularly the ironic get out clause, but then I am uncomfortable with a lot of what passes for comedy theses days. Rape is an emotive issue, but there are a lot of issues that probably ought to be just as emotive.
You're probably right. Maybe the material is so insubstantial that it couldn't distract me from the reality.
Quote: keewik @ October 29 2009, 1:02 AM BSTThat apart, I find it so sad you all think it's fine to make rape jokes at a stag 'do' (or anywhere else). Surely you realise rape isn't just a bit of slap and tickle with a bit of resistance from the victim - the rapist will piss on and in his victim and do God-knows what other kind of horrible things. Some victims commit suicide because they can't live with what's happened. I do realise comedy has to push the boundaries but I find it impossible to understand how rape jokes can ever be funny. I notice all but one of the posts here are by men. Think male rape. Think of some revolting bastard sticking his cock up your arse. Really think about it - it could happen to you as you walk along a street in the dark on your own. Really, really think about it and then decide if you think it's funny.
*really, really thinks*
You've talked me around, I'm against rape now. Should be a law or something...
EDIT: Oh, rape jokes? Well, some people say they can be funny, some people say they can't. I say they can, you say they can't. What's the truth? At the end of the day it's your word against mine, isn't it?
I thought he liked rape jokes but not grape jokes?
EDIT: Oh, no, sorry, my mistake.
Quote: Timbo @ October 29 2009, 1:05 AM BSTAren't jokes about male rape - soap in the showers and all that - quite common?
Only if the rapist is wearing a 'clown mask'... apparently.
I read this before the edit / extension etc and I'm afraid I still don't find the rape jokes any more palatable, especially the clown mask. I understand what you and others are getting at when you say that many areas of comedy cause controversy. It all seems a bit academic though, as ultimately you have to find a comedienne who is stick thin and doesn't find rape jokes repugnant. Chances – slim to none.
Also in Keewick's defence I don't believe she was insinuating that people weren't aware of the legality of rape I think she was pointing out that it is more equivalent to having your penis split open with a hammer than saying 'no, oh go on then'.