The Beatles weren't quite rubbish. Page 8

Quote: NoggetFred @ August 1 2009, 10:16 AM BST

Anyway, I think they were all pretty 'cool', in the popularly accepted meaning of the term (although I've got a lot of sympathy for David Mitchell's view of 'cool'). However, I heard an interview with Pete Best many years ago in which he sounded very bitter, claiming the band sacked him because all the girls loved him too much, and it certainly seems to be true that he got the lion's share of attention; and he said that he was a better drummer than Ringo at that time. So either he's being very uncool with his sour grapes, or they were very uncool to have acted in that way, if indeed they did (which I don't know).

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You'd have to have the moral rectitude of Jesus not to be bitter about having missed out on being in The Beatles. I'd be spitting sour grapes if the band I used to be in went on to global stardom and multi-millionaire status. Hell, I'd be picking the f**kers off with a sniper rifle.

Quote: NoggetFred @ August 1 2009, 10:16 AM BST

Anyway, I think they were all pretty 'cool', in the popularly accepted meaning of the term (although I've got a lot of sympathy for David Mitchell's view of 'cool').

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Agreed. So we're cool?

Exactly how many fifth Beatles were there?

Quote: Jane P @ August 1 2009, 9:09 AM BST

back in the 60's.

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1960s*

Quote: chipolata @ August 1 2009, 10:31 AM BST

I'd be spitting sour grapes if the band I used to be in went on to global stardom and multi-millionaire status.

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Maybe it was a bit of a poisoned chalice in some respects? Lennon was murdered for no other reason than he was so famous. Personally, while I wouldn't say no to the cash, I could do without the fame.

Quote: Aaron @ August 1 2009, 12:45 PM BST

1960s*

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Yes, as opposed to the 1860's which we're always referencing around here.

I like the sounds of Being for the Benefit of Mr Kite!
Apparently, John was inspired by a circus poster from the 40's.

Quote: Jane P @ August 1 2009, 10:33 AM BST

Exactly how many fifth Beatles were there?

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Brian Epstein
George Martin
Pete Best
Stuart Sutcliffe
Yoko Ono
Klaus Voorman

6 and counting.

Edit:

George Best
Murray the K
Billy Preston
Neil Aspinall
Ed Sullivan
El Cordobes
Liam Gallagher
Noel Gallagher
Pete Best's mum
Aunt Mimi
Maharishi Yogi
Harold Wilson
Imelda Marcos
Pickles (the dog)
Jack Ruby
Rory Delap

(Not as many as 'New Dylan's.)

Quote: Griff @ August 1 2009, 1:32 PM BST

So, three out of four Beatles whose fame brought them tragedy, if you include Paul's marriage to Heather Mills.

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But at least that marriage gave us the classic 'going down on One Knee' gag.

Quote: NoggetFred @ August 1 2009, 10:16 AM BST

Pete Best was a better drummer than Ringo at that time.

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This is actually a bit of an urban legend. Ringo was a session drummer prior to the Beatles and you have to be far better than average to make a living at that.

Three drummers played on versions of Love Me Do: Ringo; Best; and Alan White. We're lucky enough to have all three versions released. Best's version resurfaced in 1994.

The Anthology 1 version of Best's Love Me Do reveals the real reason why he was ditched. In comparison with the others, Best's version is slower, lacks energy, the beat varies (not in a good sense) and contains a huge error repeated twice. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Swhf6x6I9Y

During the verses Best plays a straight snare on the 2nd and 4th beats. In the the first line of the chorus (1:01 - using the YouTube vid), he continues the drum pattern but adds cymbal work. Then at the end of the first vocal line (around 1:06) he remembers he's supposed to play the chorus differently. You get a few mistimed and tentative snare hits (at 1:05-7) before he lurches into a very different snare pattern. He repeats the same mistake during the harmonica solo (1:39 onwards) but this time he drops the snare pattern in halfway through what'd be the first vocal line; reinforcing his mistake because the pattern shifts don't even manage to occur in the same place within the song structure.

On listening to this recording, Epstein, Martin, and the other Beatles would have realised there was a serious problem and that there was going to be only one (though highly unpopular) decision to be made.

Quote: Tim Walker @ August 1 2009, 2:54 PM BST

Yes, as opposed to the 1860's which we're always referencing around here.

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1860s*

Just thinking of the future. I'm planning on a long life for the BCG.

Quote: JohnnyD @ August 1 2009, 4:22 PM BST

I like the sounds of Being for the Benefit of Mr Kite!
Apparently, John was inspired by a circus poster from the 40's.

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40s*

Quote: Griff @ August 1 2009, 1:32 PM BST

(* - I've heard mixed opinions from drummers, some of whom say he was pretty good and is unfairly maligned.)

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Ringo was and is a staggering drummer - Strawberry Fields Forever I listen to just for the drumming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7NoOhmVMac

Each time he comes in, it lifts the song and from 2:30 onwards he rocks my life with a solid display during the final chorus and glorious drumming fadeout.

Quote: Aaron @ August 1 2009, 6:54 PM BST

40s*

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Hey! Why is he allowed to say 40s but I can't say 60s? That's ageist. >_<

Johnny D - thanks for the clarication. So they were basically leading the way for Blazin' Squad?

Quote: Aaron @ August 1 2009, 6:54 PM BST

40s*

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I know. I was trying to lure you into correcting me:
1940s*

so I could correct you:
1840s*

(I don't know why I bother sometimes; others don't know why I bother ever.)

Quote: Jane P @ August 1 2009, 7:03 PM BST

So they were basically leading the way for Blazin' Squad?

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You're confusing me with someone who is under sixty!

Quote: SlagA @ August 1 2009, 6:55 PM BST

Ringo was and is a staggering drummer - Strawberry Fields Forever I listen to just for the drumming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7NoOhmVMac

Each time he comes in, it lifts the song and from 2:30 onwards he rocks my life with a solid display during the final chorus and glorious drumming fadeout.

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OK SlagA I'm prepared to admit when I'm wrong. I've just listened to this version which is pure Ringo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1Zr8ohkv18

From this day forth I shall respect his drumming abilities more if not his celebrity persona.

And Johnny never stop bothering.

Quote: Jane P @ August 1 2009, 7:18 PM BST

OK SlagA I'm prepared to admit when I'm wrong. I've just listened to this version which is pure Ringo. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1Zr8ohkv18

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I wasn't aiming comments at anyone, honest.

I love that version of the Strawberry Fields drumming in isolation - thanks for making me aware of it.

Ticket to Ride ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn_kNeorDSk ) is a great example of how drumming can totally change a song. The intro and verse guitar is very straightforward rhythmically but when the drums come in Ringo plays them sparingly and puts emphasis in offbeats, totally transforming the way we hear the rather bland guitar parts. The pauses, the rolls, the double-time sections, are yummy.

Quote: SlagA @ August 1 2009, 6:52 PM BST

This is actually a bit of an urban legend. Ringo was a session drummer prior to the Beatles and you have to be far better than average to make a living at that.

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Really? I've never heard that before. Where was he a session drummer? I don't think there were any recording studios in Liverpool at the time.