Quote: Scottidog @ July 1 2009, 7:11 PM BSTYour 24 Leev...
Me too.
God, like, what are the chances.
Million to 1?
Biggest Question? Page 4
Quote: Leevil @ July 1 2009, 7:33 PM BSTMillion to 1?
24-1
Having a stab at LeeH's question: How can the finite and fallible comprehend the apparently infinite? Because the answer, given the nature of its subject (the motives in the mind of an infinite being), will likely be inconceivable to our finite minds, even the God Lite version. Let's face it. We're all very dim little pieces of protoplasm that inhabit a frighteningly small part of the universe and we perceive this tiny slice of the universe through a similarly tiny ranges of senses.
The answer I was given (when I asked similar) is that even though God knew how mankind would turn out, He still went ahead and did it. It's like having kids. You know how they'll turn out (they're going to be little humans with free will that insist on ignoring your experience and advice and cock it up for themselves) and although you love them dearly, it still doesn't stop you feeling disappointed when they fall short of their own dreams and expectations. You always knew before you had them there was going to be pain mixed with joy but foreknowing this, you still went ahead and had the little bleeders.
Er... Thanks for that, Mum. 
Chappers refers to Blaise Pascal's famous notion. Paraphrased, if you bet there is no God and you're right then you can't even pick up your winnings. But if you're wrong, you have to pay up. The bet against will always lose, even when it apparently 'wins'.
My big question is: If I knew the right question to ask, would I have the integrity, humility, and humanity to ask it?
Quote: SlagA @ July 1 2009, 11:09 PM BSTChappers refers to Blaise Pascal's famous notion. Paraphrased, if you bet there is no God and you're right then you can't even pick up your winnings. But if you're wrong, you have to pay up. The bet against will always lose, even when it apparently 'wins'.
Er - did I?
Ha, Dave was clever by accident.
I think most people think of God as a supreme do-gooder. But in fact what's to say God is a good guy? There's no reason to believe that if a supreme being or beings made the universe (please see Slartibartfast for details) that they were good guys/girls/its. Interestingly Hawkins' A Brief History of Time's conclusion does not rule out a supreme being/s due to the imbalance of dark and light matter. According to the laws of physics dark and light matter should be equal. And we shouldn't be here. Or indeed by there, especially if it's a damp patch.
Quote: Lee Henman @ July 1 2009, 6:52 PM BSTAh...I see how you're trying to wriggle out of this one...no, I don't. But God would. Because he's God. God would do everything to the best of his abilities, because to suggest that he wouldn't would make him fallible, which is unacceptable to Christians.
Wasn't trying to wriggle out of anything. If God exists and He is omnipotent then he is capable of doing or not doing absolutely anything at all. You suggest that because He is capable of doing everything, then He would do so. That just doesn't make sense.
If God is capable of knowing how every tiny thing will turn out but chooses not to use that power, that doesn't make God fallible and allows free will.
It's funny when people have these discusions about what God is like, or should be like, as obvioulsy we have no idea and so it's all a bit redundant. Plus the fact he's not real. (Unless he/it is)
Quote: Matthew Stott @ July 2 2009, 9:44 AM BSTIt's funny when people have these discusions about what God is like, or should be like, as obvioulsy we have no idea.
True.
I was only running with the kind of God LeeH proposed in his What if? An all-knowing all-powerful God, twas all. Concepts like infinity, dimensions, etc, fascinate me, even if they do make me feel ever more insignificant and incapable. Maybe that is why I like them? 
Quote: Matthew Stott @ July 2 2009, 9:44 AM BSTIt's funny when people have these discusions about what God is like, or should be like, as obvioulsy we have no idea and so it's all a bit redundant. Plus the fact he's not real. (Unless he/it is)
I like to think of him as a big space pony.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ July 2 2009, 9:44 AM BSTIt's funny when people have these discusions about what God is like, or should be like, as obvioulsy we have no idea and so it's all a bit redundant. Plus the fact he's not real. (Unless he/it is)
I think God was removed from the equation a long tome ago, they're really having a discussion on the definitions of the words infallible and infinite, etc.
Regarding the bigger questions in life...
This is an absolutely superb film. Proposing answers to the spiritual questions in life by way of quantum physics. As someone with a science background, it's refreshing to watch something that addresses the big questions based on research rather than vague religious instincts. It's very much directed to the lay person rather than someone with a good grasp of physics; and achieves this without being patronising in any way.
I would definitely recommend getting hold of a copy and sharing it with friends. I picked a copy up at HMV for a fiver - a real bargain. (The extra DVD materials are great too.)
Quote: Tim Walker @ July 2 2009, 12:44 PM BSTI would definitely recommend getting hold of a copy and sharing it with friends. I picked a copy up at HMV for a fiver - a real bargain. (The extra DVD materials are great too.)
I bought a pirated copy for the equivalent of 15 pence in Indonesia and felt ripped off. There is more to be learnt from viewing Doctor Who and the Silurians.
Quote: SlagA @ July 2 2009, 10:29 AM BSTTrue.
I was only running with the kind of God LeeH proposed in his What if? An all-knowing all-powerful God, twas all. Concepts like infinity, dimensions, etc, fascinate me, even if they do make me feel ever more insignificant and incapable. Maybe that is why I like them?
Because time always was and space goes on forever.....................
Aaaaaagh! I can't get my head round that.
Yep, if you reeeeeeeeeeally try to visualise forever, or space going on and filling an infinite... space :/, you just can't.