Remove Scum Petition

Hello all,

Following the incident with my daughter that can be read about in the scum thread (Thanks for all of your support on that thread)

We spent yesterday at the police station - although a comment that did upset me was because the piece of scum was young the punishment might not be that harsh.

Anyway, I have started on the campain trail and got a petition going.

If anyone would like to sign the link is below and I thank you.

The wording is

We press the government to make our streets safer, particularly for young people, by introducing harsher, mandatory, custodial sentences for those convicted of assault or violent crimes.

In addition we press the government to introduce laws that required those convicted of assault or violent crime to reimburse the National Health Service the cost of the medical treatment for their victim.

We also press the government to introduce new harsher measures to punish those under eighteen convicted of assault or violent crimes and in addition consider punishments for parents of these criminals.

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/safeuk/

EDIT - It appears that once you have filled in your details ( 10 second job) they send you an email with a link to click on that you have to send back for your name to be added - please don't forget this final step!

Excellent.

Although it should be Government (capitalised).

Signed, Sealed and Delivered (I'm yours).

I really think you should strip down to your pants. I hear they like that, and when I say they, I mean me, and when I say me, I mean Aaron, and when I say Aaron, I mean you, Griff.

Thanks Guys!

Oh, so that's why I voted badger.

Hi bigfella,

Whilst I fully understand your desire to introduce such legislation, I feel that the proposed measures may not be entirely practical.

If you were to put away every 14-17 year old in the country for an assault charge, you'd need to build another fifty prisons, along with the creation of extra courthouses, prison staff, judges, social workers, etc., etc. The cost of which would bankrupt the country.

Please understand that I'm not being callous in any way and that what happened to your daughter was dreadful in the extreme. But what I am saying is that a Charge of Assault covers a massively wide spectrum of incidents - some major, most minor.

If two normally decent and law abiding 17 year olds get in a punch up outside of a pub and are picked up by the police and charged with Assault, should they both go to jail for 10 years, thus ruining the rest of their lives over a minor fracas?

If a 15 year old drug addict stabs another drug addict and the NHS costs for treating that patient run into the tens of thousands of pounds, do you really think a teenager would be able to re-imburse the Government?

I fully understand that you want to do more to protect your daughter and I applaud the great restraint you've shown by not going round to the assailant's house to seek revenge.

The restraint you have shown probably has a lot to do with the age and gender of the thug, which unfortunately, is also how the law will see her. You are in a terrible situation and must feel somewhat powerless with how you can respond.

I think your petition is a great idea and I would like to get behind it, but you will need to think of the financial considerations and re-word it with some legal specifics, if you want any chance of it succeeding.

I do hope that the evil bitch who attacked your daughter feels the full weight of the law and that your family can get closure on the incident.

Good luck with it all.

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ July 1 2009, 1:41 PM BST

If you were to put away every 14-17 year old in the country for an assault charge, you'd need to build another fifty prisons, along with the creation of extra courthouses, prison staff, judges, social workers, etc., etc.

View original

Good. That's what we need.

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ July 1 2009, 1:41 PM BST

The cost of which would bankrupt the country.

View original

We're not already? It'd be a reallocation of funds and investment for future. All the NHS money and police hours (= money) that would be saved by having these thugs off the streets would make up for it.

And regarding the cost of the prisoners' accommodation, the prisons should be bread-and-water Victorian stylee following a much-needed scrapping of the human rights act.

Quote: Aaron @ July 1 2009, 1:58 PM BST

And regarding the cost of the prisoners' accommodation, the prisons should be bread-and-water Victorian stylee following a much-needed scrapping of the human rights act.

View original

I thought you were for good old Blighty, Aaron and all that it stood for? Fair play, etc. Have you thought about moving to China?

I think we should take a leaf out of Demolition Man's book/frame and freeze the bastards.

Don't worry about individual cryogenic pods, just bung em all in a big freezer at Iceland.

Mums gone to Iceland; she were claimin' benefits fraudulently

Quote: Renegade Carpark @ July 1 2009, 1:41 PM BST

Hi bigfella,

Whilst I fully understand your desire to introduce such legislation, I feel that the proposed measures may not be entirely practical.

If you were to put away every 14-17 year old in the country for an assault charge, you'd need to build another fifty prisons, along with the creation of extra courthouses, prison staff, judges, social workers, etc., etc. The cost of which would bankrupt the country.

Please understand that I'm not being callous in any way and that what happened to your daughter was dreadful in the extreme. But what I am saying is that a Charge of Assault covers a massively wide spectrum of incidents - some major, most minor.

If two normally decent and law abiding 17 year olds get in a punch up outside of a pub and are picked up by the police and charged with Assault, should they both go to jail for 10 years, thus ruining the rest of their lives over a minor fracas?

If a 15 year old drug addict stabs another drug addict and the NHS costs for treating that patient run into the tens of thousands of pounds, do you really think a teenager would be able to re-imburse the Government?

I fully understand that you want to do more to protect your daughter and I applaud the great restraint you've shown by not going round to the assailant's house to seek revenge.

The restraint you have shown probably has a lot to do with the age and gender of the thug, which unfortunately, is also how the law will see her. You are in a terrible situation and must feel somewhat powerless with how you can respond.

I think your petition is a great idea and I would like to get behind it, but you will need to think of the financial considerations and re-word it with some legal specifics, if you want any chance of it succeeding.

I do hope that the evil bitch who attacked your daughter feels the full weight of the law and that your family can get closure on the incident.

Good luck with it all.

View original

Hi RC

Thanks for the thoughts and the kind words.

All I am saying is there should be harsher punishments - I'm not suggesting 10 years.

I don't think there is anything wrong with a 17 year old spending a night in the cells if convicented - having an experiance of prison might put them off doing it again.

I'm not sure why people can't go through life without having a fight though - I have managed 33 years of it and I'm sure most people are the same.

There is no reason why the payment to the NHS can't be in time as opposed to money. Get them in to help cleaning or showing old ladies where to go for their appointments.

Quote: bigfella @ July 1 2009, 2:03 PM BST

I'm not sure why people can't go through life without having a fight though - I have managed 33 years of it and I'm sure most people are the same.

View original

Good for you!

However a lot of people are brought up with a lot violence and consequently have problems with anger and frustration and don't know other ways of expressing it. Or some people grow up coping with a hard 'dog eat dog' life with aggression and violence. I'm not condoning it, just saying why it happens and how we have to get to the root of the problem before people become violent individuals.

Personally I'd like to see the government sort out better childcare options for under-5s as one solution.

You just need to narrow the scope of the crime.

An unprovoked attack is in a completely different realm than 2 teens having a scuffle after school.

Using a weapon or kicking someone in the head is closer to attempted murder than it is assault.

Multiple attackers would be another special case.

Assault in the commission of a crime (theft, for example) is worse than a simple fistfight.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ July 1 2009, 2:09 PM BST

Good for you!

However a lot of people are brought up with a lot violence and consequently have problems with anger and frustration and don't know other ways of expressing it. Or some people grow up coping with a hard 'dog eat dog' life with aggression and violence. I'm not condoning it, just saying why it happens and how we have to get to the root of the problem before people become violent individuals.

Personally I'd like to see the government sort out better childcare options for under-5s as one solution.

View original

Don't disagree.

We need both aspects.

1. A strong deterrent

2. Try to sort out why this is becoming a problem.

But without the deterrent anything else that is put in place is doomed to failure.

bigfella - thanks for your response, I was really worried that I might have offended you in some way.

Personally, I don't think the Government wants to address some of these issues due to the legal minefield and costs involved, they'd rather just sweep it all under the carpet.

Unfortunately, here in London, there has been a number of high profile teenage murders and the parents of the victims have handed in petitions time and time again to the Labour Government.

Each time Labour has promised to introduce new laws and each time they fail to deliver on their promises. I wish the system didn't suck so bad.

Again, I wish you the best of luck.