Scum Page 19

Quote: Bad dog @ June 29 2009, 11:56 AM BST

The solution? Punish wrongoers, not the innocent. Give the power to discipline back to teachers, parents and the police. And believe in concepts like right and wrong, once again.

View original

What discipline though?

I think it needs to start way, way earlier. How many toddlers have you seen being verbally abused by their mothers? Within the last week I've heard a mother tell her baby to "shut up!" when it was crying, a toddler to "get here now!" and then dragged by the arm and a girl of about five called a "stupid idiot" for a minor wrong-doing. And this is how they treat their children in public. You can see how these children can easily become violent themselves. Mass nursery childcare is also now seen as a cause of some anti-social behaviour in some children - the sort of childcare the government want all children placed in so mothers can work.

Quote: sootyj @ June 29 2009, 12:00 PM BST

Is that a sly compliment?

View original

Ha!

I suppose the answer is a fair loving upbringin, but how would you legislate for that?

Shouting at kids really isn't a good thing, but neither are kids convinced they're worthy of all the respect in the world when they haven't had a chance to earn it yet.

Quote: Bad dog @ June 29 2009, 11:56 AM BST

Whoever did this should be off the streets immediately, and get a custodial sentence. You really cannot allow behaviour like this in society.

The problem is that for a long time the enemy within have been chipping away inside the system, so you cannot punish anyone anymore, teachers, parents and the police have their hands tied, and people who should be punished get away with doing what they want. No party has the will, or the inclination to turn it around. If kids don't want an education, they cause havoc at school and you can't touch them. The parents, usually single parent families, let them do whatever they want and can't control them. Then a few years down the line you have these problem kids having their own families, who just follow the pattern.

The solution? Punish wrongoers, not the innocent. Give the power to discipline back to teachers, parents and the police. And believe in concepts like right and wrong, once again.

View original

Basically, vote Aaron for PM.

Quote: bigfella @ June 29 2009, 11:55 AM BST

Maybe, but I'd rather they come round our house. I don't want my daughter to feel intimidated in the police station environment.

View original

Damn right! The daughter is the victim and should be cared for and not have to be dragged to a police station. Hope she's better now?

Quote: sootyj @ June 29 2009, 12:05 PM BST

I suppose the answer is a fair loving upbringin, but how would you legislate for that?

Shouting at kids really isn't a good thing, but neither are kids convinced they're worthy of all the respect in the world when they haven't had a chance to earn it yet.

View original

I think education is the answer. About parenting and also about seeing why we behave the way we do ourselves.

I don';t think kids need to earn respect. I see them learning to respect others and themselves from birth. Thye need security foremost.

It would also greatly help if the government didn't look down on motherhood and devalue the part a mother should play in a child's life and think it can be substituted by any one. It would also help if mothers didn't have to work in order to just pay a mortgage or afford basic living standards.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 29 2009, 12:04 PM BST

What discipline though?

a toddler to "get here now!" and then dragged by the arm

View original

Isn't this illegal in the UK?

Quote: hey_nonny @ June 29 2009, 12:10 PM BST

Isn't this illegal in the UK?

View original

No.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 29 2009, 12:11 PM BST

No.

View original

Another good reason for being an expat

Quote: hey_nonny @ June 29 2009, 12:12 PM BST

Another good reason for being an expat

View original

Would it be illegal in Germany?

Albeit fat kids are illegal.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 29 2009, 12:13 PM BST

Would it be illegal in Germany?

View original

Of course, any sort of physical abuse witnessed in public and the kids are taken off you by the "Jugendamt" can't remember what this is called in English.
Edit.
Mental abuse too

I retract the comment I made earlier regarding single parents. That isn't a mark of bad parenting or deliquent children, I had the recent story of the 12 year old trouble maker (whose mum calls him "my little satan") in mind.

Behaviour is learned, so we have to ask what are the kids learning from their parents. Well, that life is all about "me." Didn't Mrs Thatcher say "there is no such thing as society?" In other words, every man for himself.

It shows the extent of the problem, when to talk of punishing criminals is seen as right-wing.

Quote: hey_nonny @ June 29 2009, 12:15 PM BST

the "Jugendamt" can't remember what this is called in English.

View original

Social Services? Well, there's children dying at the hands of their parents whilst being 'monitored' by Social Services here, whilst others take children away over seemingly trivial matters.

Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 29 2009, 12:21 PM BST

Social Services? Well, there's children dying at the hands of their parents whilst being 'monitored' by Social Services here, whilst others take children away over seemingly trivial matters.

View original

And the Austrians just keep them in the cellar

Quote: hey_nonny @ June 29 2009, 12:29 PM BST

And the Austrians just keep them in the cellar

View original

Ah, but they're very strict parents and very into discipline. Hmmm....