I get that but I was thinking of a practical way to reflect.
For example in Allo Allo every one speaks to Rene so there may be half a dozen plots but they all pass through the same character which pulls the plot together.
Back to Class - Thank You For The Music Page 4
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Quote: sootyj @ June 20 2009, 11:33 PM BSTI get that but I was thinking of a practical way to reflect.
For example in Allo Allo every one speaks to Rene so there may be half a dozen plots but they all pass through the same character which pulls the plot together.
Yeah I like what your saying. Keith would properly be our Rene with other characters being affected by his actions. I know Mark is often push to the edge because of Keith's actions but Keith is unaware of this. Add a few more characters to the mix and you've got a mockumentary/sitcom/farce e.g. Back to Class.
hello people, I'm Dan Pearce, The creator and Co-writer of 'Back to Class' thank you for the feedback.
Having read all of your comments, I can see that there is a lot of critisism over Ian the narrator which I can sort of understand. But we made this pilot on absolutely no budget. We want to make the proper pilot with a budget and have already planned this.
I agree that mockumentary has already been done, but I feel that there is still a gap in the market for more with the right producers and channel.
We know that this isn't to everybodies taste but the audience which we have identified have so far come back and said they love it and would love to see it developed and made.
I know there is room for improvement. And we know where we need to improve.
Thanks for the feedback though,
all the best,
Dan
N.B. the best book I ever read on scripts was the Soprano scripts book.
The whole basis of years of TV was covered in the first page.
Quote: Dan Pearce @ June 20 2009, 11:40 PM BST
Having read all of your comments, I can see that there is a lot of critisism over Ian the narrator which I can sort of understand. But we made this pilot on absolutely no budget. We want to make the proper pilot with a budget and have already planned this.
I agree that mockumentary has already been done, but I feel that there is still a gap in the market for more with the right producers and channel.
We know that this isn't to everybodies taste but the audience which we have identified have so far come back and said they love it and would love to see it developed and made.
I know there is room for improvement. And we know where we need to improve.
Thanks for the feedback though,
all the best,
Dan
Well said Dan. We are thankful for all of the feedback like Dan said but almost all of the criticisms so far we have already identified and know with a decent producer and budget we can amend to make Back to Class a hit show.
Quote: Dan Pearce @ June 20 2009, 11:40 PM BSTI agree that mockumentary has already been done, but I feel that there is still a gap in the market for more with the right producers and channel.
Based on what though?
Why are you starting off with something that's been 'done'?
You're meant to be the 'new guys' - the innovators - but you continue to defend this?
"Sorry, it's been done before" is about the most common reason for getting knocked back there is.
I can't see this going well for you - which is a shame,because your enthusiasm is to be applauded.
You've had quite a lot of pretty specific crit now - but in the end it's up to you what you do with it.
Quote: Lazzard @ June 20 2009, 11:51 PM BSTBased on what though?
Why are you starting off with something that's been 'done'?
You're meant to be the 'new guys' - the innovators - but you continue to defend this?
"Sorry, it's been done before" is about the most common reason for getting knocked back there is.
I can't see this going well for you - which is a shame,because your enthusiasm is to be applauded.
You've had quite a lot of pretty specific crit now - but in the end it's up to you what you do with it.
i know what u mean, but we have already generated media industry interest in back to class, one producer is interested and several media companies. yes we understand what you are all saying but we wouldn't pursue this further if we didn't have the confidence that people are interested
Hi Dan and James
I can see a lot of similarities with the That Peter Kay thing, but the sort of documentaries it 'mocks' (Airport, etc) aren't made anymore (I don't think). That Peter Kay Thing was also a series of one-offs, whereas you're trying to do a sitcom...
When you say you've had loads of positive feedback from the target audience, are you referring to friends?
I liked the bit when the students are trying not to laugh, but I liked it because they weren't acting.
I understand that if the show was professionly made you'd have different cast, voice-over etc. So I can't see how this film can help your cause with producers. When you say producers are interested on the basis of this film, can you be more specific because I must admit I'm surprised.
Sorry, you've had a lot of flak here, but I feel it has been fair and constructive. Your self-belief is admirable, but don't let it stand in the way of improving what you do.
Quote: James Cotter @ June 20 2009, 10:44 PM BSTYou find it's more like 10% because the episode is 12 minutes long. There's two parts but it's the same episode. Fair enough there is properly too much intro but it is meant to be a mockumentary in the style of 'That Peter Kay Thing' and have you ever seen the voice over induction on the episode entitled 'Eyes Down'?
I'm confused - isn't 5 minutes of a 12 minute episode nearer 50%?
Quote: Dolly Dagger @ June 21 2009, 8:56 AM BSTHi Dan and James
I can see a lot of similarities with the That Peter Kay thing, but the sort of documentaries it 'mocks' (Airport, etc) aren't made anymore (I don't think). That Peter Kay Thing was also a series of one-offs, whereas you're trying to do a sitcom...
When you say you've had loads of positive feedback from the target audience, are you referring to friends?
I liked the bit when the students are trying not to laugh, but I liked it because they weren't acting.
I understand that if the show was professionly made you'd have different cast, voice-over etc. So I can't see how this film can help your cause with producers. When you say producers are interested on the basis of this film, can you be more specific because I must admit I'm surprised.
Sorry, you've had a lot of flak here, but I feel it has been fair and constructive. Your self-belief is admirable, but don't let it stand in the way of improving what you do.
I'm confused - isn't 5 minutes of a 12 minute episode nearer 50%?
We've had loads of positive feedback from a few industry people (Luke Lovell who was the producer of Bear Grylls to name one) as well as the target audience when we had a mini screening of it, we are of course having a bigger screening of it in a few weeks when it screens at the Picture House.
We maybe quite young but we're not naïve. We haven't just shown it to a few mates who say it's good and that's it, that would be plain stupidity just to do that little audience research, we have both got top marks in our BETC National Diploma in Media Production so we do know a little about demographics, audience research and target markets.
I'm glad you like one bit at least. That scene was funny like a fair few others, because of the acting and the way it was played. It isn't just a bunch of students having a giggle it's well thought out by all involved to look as natural as possible.
And what someone else was saying about 20% of the episode was taken up by voice over was wrong. He stupidly thought the episode was only five minutes long when it is in fact 12 minutes long meaning what he said about the voice over taking 20% of the episode up because it was the full first minute was wrong so it would work out to about 10% of the entire 12 minute episode. I hope that has cleared up that debate.
Quote: JohnnyD @ June 21 2009, 10:51 AM BSTNo laughs from me I'm afraid - other than from the contagious laughter of the students.
Not to worry though, I'm very much in 'the wrong demographic for the show'.
"the contagious laughter of the students" a positive or negative?
Quote: James Cotter @ June 21 2009, 11:28 AM BSTWe've had loads of positive feedback from a few industry people (Luke Lovell who was the producer of Bear Grylls to name one) as well as the target audience when we had a mini screening of it, we are of course having a bigger screening of it in a few weeks when it screens at the Picture House.
We maybe quite young but we're not naïve. We haven't just shown it to a few mates who say it's good and that's it, that would be plain stupidity just to do that little audience research, we have both got top marks in our BETC National Diploma in Media Production so we do know a little about demographics, audience research and target markets.
I'm glad you like one bit at least. That scene was funny like a fair few others, because of the acting and the way it was played. It isn't just a bunch of students having a giggle it's well thought out by all involved to look as natural as possible.
And what someone else was saying about 20% of the episode was taken up by voice over was wrong. He stupidly thought the episode was only five minutes long when it is in fact 12 minutes long meaning what he said about the voice over taking 20% of the episode up because it was the full first minute was wrong so it would work out to about 10% of the entire 12 minute episode. I hope that has cleared up that debate.
"the contagious laughter of the students" a positive or a negative?
Quote: James Cotter @ June 21 2009, 11:29 AM BSTwe have both got top marks in our BETC National Diploma in Media Production so we do know a little about demographics, audience research and target markets.
Oh for the days when the BBC just told Galton & Simpson to go away and write something funny.
He stupidly thought
Waits for Sooty's shirt to start ripping...
Quote: Timbo @ June 21 2009, 11:35 AM BSTOh for the days when the BBC just told Galton & Simpson to go away and write something funny.
Waits for Sooty's shirt to start ripping...
"Oh for the days when the BBC just told Galton & Simpson to go away and write something funny."
I'm not saying are marks are anything to do with our writing or acting. I was responding to a remark made about knowing who are target audience were. I was simply saying that we do have some knowledge about media production.
When you see 50 odd posts in Critque you know that there has to be a frank exchange of views.
I've watched the first half and can say it did nothing for me.
But, this is the important thing, in comedy you will never please everyone - so I think you should write what you think is funny - which you guys do.
Don't make the mistake of trying to write something for someone else, it will never work. (I'm not saying that you will)
It's hard when you get negative feedback, it used to hit me like a bombshell. Then I realised that some of the stuff that got good great feedback on here never sold and some that got slammed netted me a cheque ( a small one, of course).
But, some of the advice given here is great - its up to you if you take it or not.
Good luck with it all!
Quote: sootyj @ June 20 2009, 9:13 PM BSTThen who the hell do they interract with? Sitcom is all about character and interaction. Unless this is some eccentric example of supposedly comedic Noe theatre?
Niether do most good sitcoms they have character and situational humour. This is just a bloke pretending he's in the army and shouting and a rather generic cliche.
Emotional points where?
Might I suggest you get the script critiqued before filming in future.
They do interact of course but not on the same level as other sitcoms/mocumentaries for example. There actions impact on each others life's as well as the students life's and education.
Mark isn't pretending he is the army he was in the army in the world we created. The army has effected him greatly because something happened to him when he was there which makes him hide behind the masquerade of army morals. I think that also answers the emotional points questions to.
Quote: JohnnyD @ June 21 2009, 11:46 AM BSTGetting someone to laugh at a sitcom is always 'positive'. If your actors were (as I assume) laughing nervously off-script, then write it in.
Yes they did find that scene very funny because I ad-libbed most of it. We retro-scripted the scene because I felt it would work best as I and my co-star are good at improv. Although saying that, this was the second take and not the first as the first was marred by far too much laughter. We also did a third take which lasted even longer by it was felt that the second take hid the nail on the head.
Quote: James Cotter @ June 21 2009, 11:29 AM BST(Luke Lovell who was the producer of Bear Grylls to name one)
We maybe quite young but we're not naïve. We haven't just shown it to a few mates who say it's good and that's it, that would be plain stupidity just to do that little audience research, we have both got top marks in our BETC National Diploma in Media Production so we do know a little about demographics, audience research and target markets.
It would be great to get some feedback from a comedy or drama producer. One of my best friends directs and producers lifestyle and reality TV and it's very different to comedy.
That's great you're studying and getting qualifications. I'm currently doing a MA in screenwriting and work with MA directing students and we would have to work really hard to produce something we would use to try and sell our stuff to TV companies.
I understand the type of humour you want to do is difficult to put across via script and therefor making your own film is a great way to get it across, but I would really recommend working on the script a bit more and then filming a much more professional looking show with more polished performances.
Has it ever occured to you that the reason why sitcoms do what they do is not becuase the writers don't share your brilliant insights?
I wonder if John Cleese and Conny Booth sat down and said,
"Hmm why don't we make sure Manuel and Basil never meet?"
"Yes they can wander in and shout at the guests but never talk to each other."
"But won't that just be unfunny and irritating?"
"That's why Graham Chapman's going to do a droning voice over that gets on everyone's tits."
"You mean the unfunny voice over will distract from the boring action?"
"Precisley!"
Might I reccomend trying Mark Blake's excellent guide to sitcom writing. Or just watching a few decent ones and working out how what they do is funny as oposed to watching and getting exited about things they didn't do that you think you could do better.