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Life defining moments Page 3
Quote: SlagA @ April 1 2009, 6:43 PM BSTThis is just opinion and kinda my (admittedly bizarre) world-view. I think free-will and destiny are the same thing, seen from different angles.
For example, Tuumble bottled the world tour and so met his wife. But he was always going to meet her, because of who he is and the decisions he makes when given a choice.
Replay the scene, time and again - given the same choice, and his then present experience and state of mind - he would always reject the trip. He appears to have made a free choice but was it really free when the outcome was already (imo) predetermined by his character?
For me, life-defining moments are really the wrong way around. Events don't determine the person or the course of their life. It's your character that has already predetermined your choice in any future situation. Choice only serves to reveal our underlying character, to ourselves and others.
For me, in my weird world, destiny and chance are illusion. Character is the substance, that determines your path and your end.
What an interesting way of looking at it
So if I make a choice but then deliberately do the opposite, I'm in theory now doing the opposite of what I've chosen... but in reality I'm doing what I have actually chosen.
And yeah, when you think about it, it makes sense.
I knew you were going to say that, random.
Quote: Leevil @ April 2 2009, 6:43 PM BSTI knew you were going to say that, random.
So in theory theirs no reason for self regret.
If an individual was taken back to that very moment in time they now regret, they would in fact do the same again, no matter what.
It's only since living the moment can we endeavour to learn from it. And we could only change that moment if we could take back the knowledge we have gained from living it, which we can't, so...
The ripple effect in time is amazing. I can honestly say that I might never have chosen a career in comedy writing or married my wife and had a son if I'd never have gone to the secondary school I did.
Why? Because
1:
At secondary school I met a guy called Gary Fish.
2:
He asked me to go on a double date with him and these two girls.
3:
I ended up staying with one of those girls till I was 23.
4:
When we split up, I wantec to get away from my home town and took a summer job in Pontins where I met another girl, Nikki.
5:
She bought me an Emotional Rescue card for my birthday and suggested I contact the company because it was exactly my daft sense of humour.
6:
I did, and ended up working for them.
7:
One of the girls, Angie, who worked at Emotional Rescue eventually became my girlfriend, then wife.
8:
Writing the cards for a living made me think that maybe I can write comedy for a living too.
9:
And that's where I am now - all because I met Gary Fish in secondary school. If any one of those elements had not happened, my life might have taken a massive turn for the worse. (Or better - who knows?)
But why did you go to THAT secondary school? Because it was in your catchment area? Then surely it was because your parents moved there?
Quote: Lee Henman @ April 3 2009, 3:02 PM BSTThe ripple effect in time is amazing. I can honestly say that I might never have chosen a career in comedy writing or married my wife and had a son if I'd never have gone to the secondary school I did.
Why? Because
1:
At secondary school I met a guy called Gary Fish.
2:
He asked me to go on a double date with him and these two girls.
3:
I ended up staying with one of those girls till I was 23.
4:
When we split up, I wantec to get away from my home town and took a summer job in Pontins where I met another girl, Nikki.
5:
She bought me an Emotional Rescue card for my birthday and suggested I contact the company because it was exactly my daft sense of humour.
6:
I did, and ended up working for them.
7:
One of the girls, Angie, who worked at Emotional Rescue eventually became my girlfriend, then wife.
8:
Writing the cards for a living made me think that maybe I can write comedy for a living too.
9:
And that's where I am now - all because I met Gary Fish in secondary school. If any one of those elements had not happened, my life might have taken a massive turn for the worse. (Or better - who knows?)
Hang on, it's a touching heartwarming story that's left me all warm inside, but I'm not sure the steps lead logically on from each other to a career in comedy writing. It reads more like you're taking fairly random events and trying to impose a pattern on them.
Quote: random @ April 3 2009, 2:53 PM BSTIf an individual was taken back to that very moment in time they now regret, they would in fact do the same again, no matter what.
It's only since living the moment can we endeavour to learn from it. And we could only change that moment if we could take back the knowledge we have gained from living it, which we can't, so...
Imo, yes. It's the conundrum of one of my characters in a novel. She feels guilt for a past mistake but comes to recognise that second chances are useless without prescience - Groundhog Day is an example of replay with foreknowledge of the past.
For me, guilt is a necessary something to a complete human. Imo, remorse shows me a flaw in my character that I can now try and correct. It means that I'm taking some belated responsibility for past actions. It shows that I've learned to include others in my decision-making. And it gives me a chance to make amends.
So although we'd (without knowledge of the future) still make the same choices; remorse is still crucial in moulding that person.
Quote: chipolata @ April 3 2009, 3:08 PM BSTHang on, it's a touching heartwarming story that's left me all warm inside, but I'm not sure the steps lead logically on from each other to a career in comedy writing. It reads more like you're taking fairly random events and trying to impose a pattern on them.
Not at all. None of those steps would have occurred without any of the preceding ones. If I'd never met Gary Fish, I'd certainly never have met my first wife, hence I'd never have ran away to Pontins when we split up, and I'd never have met Nikki who bought me the greetings card etc etc etc.
No. You could never have met Gary Fish but some other factor could have made you want to get away from home at 23.
Quote: Lee Henman @ April 3 2009, 3:13 PM BSTNot at all. None of those steps would have occurred without any of the preceding ones. If I'd never met Gary Fish, I'd certainly never have met my first wife, hence I'd never have ran away to Pontins when we split up, and I'd never have met Nikki who bought me the greetings card etc etc etc.
But because of who you are, you wouldn't have ever chosen a different path, if your character predetermines your decisions.
Quote: EllieJP @ April 3 2009, 3:08 PM BSTBut why did you go to THAT secondary school? Because it was in your catchment area? Then surely it was because your parents moved there?
Because he failed his 11+. 
Quote: Lee Henman @ April 3 2009, 3:13 PM BSTNot at all. None of those steps would have occurred without any of the preceding ones. If I'd never met Gary Fish, I'd certainly never have met my first wife, hence I'd never have ran away to Pontins when we split up, and I'd never have met Nikki who bought me the greetings card etc etc etc.
Wife? You didn't say you'd married her!
Quote: chipolata @ April 3 2009, 3:25 PM BSTNo. You could never have met Gary Fish but some other factor could have made you want to get away from home at 23.
Highly unlikely. But for your scenario to work I'd have had to not only get away from home, but also meet Nikki from Pontins who lived 200 miles away from me.
Quote: random @ April 3 2009, 4:00 PM BSTBut because of who you are, you wouldn't have ever chosen a different path, if your character predetermines your decisions.
No, that doesn't work either. I would never have thought of writing for greetings cards unless goaded into it. At the time I was a binman.
Quote: Aaron @ April 3 2009, 5:06 PM BSTWife? You didn't say you'd married her!
I didn't - we were engaged though. I always call her my first wife because we did everything but marry - live together, have a kid etc.
But ... you weren't actually married. Just typically northern, LIVING IN SIN.