Quote: sootyj @ January 28 2009, 2:42 PM GMTOur current attitude towards violent crime is a mugger and burglars charter.
But is the answer really to allow guns onto the streets? Would that make us safer?
Bushbama Page 11
Quote: sootyj @ January 28 2009, 2:42 PM GMTI do, a mature society can accept citizens equipped to manage their own defence.
Is that such an odd idea?
Hm. I sort of think it is, yeah; I'd hate to think that all the homes surrounding me where equipped with weaponary. That's not the sort of world I want to live in.
Quote: chipolata @ January 28 2009, 2:45 PM GMTBut is the answer really to allow guns onto the streets? Would that make us safer?
Exactly. A pretty odd way to look at things.
Quote: DaButt @ January 28 2009, 2:44 PM GMTMy whole point about Bush was that the manufactured level of partisan attacks was so great that his actual shortcomings were hidden amid the din. Don't you find it ironic that a thundering roar of anti-Bush tirades was acceptable, yet a couple of "Obama is just another in a long series of politicians" posts have your panties in a bunch?
Considering the damage Bush did to your countries reputation and standing across the world, you should be joining in the anti-Bush tirades.
Quote: chipolata @ January 28 2009, 2:45 PM GMTBut is the answer really to allow guns onto the streets? Would that make us safer?
Yes
Quote: DaButt @ January 28 2009, 2:44 PM GMTRead my posts without filtering them through your own prejudices. My entire point about Obama is that he's been undeservedly anointed as some sort of mythical figure and I'll I've done is point out that he's a politician and will likely disappoint his most ardent supporters.
My whole point about Bush was that the manufactured level of partisan attacks was so great that his actual shortcomings were hidden amid the din. Don't you find it ironic that a thundering roar of anti-Bush tirades was acceptable, yet a couple of "Obama is just another in a long series of politicians" posts have your panties in a bunch?
All I want to do is to present a point of view from a rational perspective as well as debunking a few myths and untruths. Just last night someone was lamenting all the crazy gun owners and their machine guns and I think I enlightened them by pointing out that automatic weapons have been illegal for 75 years.
BTW, the last one of those political compass tests I took showed me as a libertarian leftist just a little to the right of Gandhi.
I would not say you debunk as much as try to plant in a very manipulative way.
Quote: Curt @ January 28 2009, 2:28 PM GMTListen I like you and all DaButt but you are in no way centrist no matter what you want to tell yourself. It's written all over your posts.
You might not be at the far far far right but you are definitely right minded.
In addition anyone who could have voted for Bush twice in a row and then argue this hard against Obama.
That's the way I look at this too Curt. Including the liking bit.
Quote: sootyj @ January 28 2009, 2:48 PM GMTYes
Yes? Sweet holy f**king baby Jesus.
And I'm pretty sure Chip was referring to the public in general, as opposed to the police.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ January 28 2009, 2:50 PM GMTAnd I'm pretty sure Chip was referring to the public in general, as opposed to the police.
I was. Hoodied youths are bad enough at the moment, without worrying they may have guns. Because no matter how tightly you try and regulate who gets guns, the weapons are going to fall into the wrong peoples hands.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ January 28 2009, 2:47 PM GMTHm. I sort of think it is, yeah; I'd hate to think that all the homes surrounding me where equipped with weaponary. That's not the sort of world I want to live in.
Well that makes Switzerland, Canada, Sweden, Finland, Australia, Poland and Germany odd. Most of whom have far lower rates of violent crimes than the UK.
Would the idea that a girl on a bus had a licensed can of pepper spray really make you crap yourself in terror? That perhaps inspired by an especially strident Germaine Greer article is going to give you a good spraying.
Or would the sheer oddness melt you're brain? Do you honestly think that other European cities streets are scarier than London or Manchester?
Quote: Matthew Stott @ January 28 2009, 2:50 PM GMTThat's the way I look at this too Curt. Including the liking bit.
Yes? Sweet holy f**king baby Jesus.
And I'm pretty sure Chip was referring to the public in general, as opposed to the police.
Oops miss read the post I said yes to. I meant yes in the hands of trained police officer and civil volunteers.
Quote: sootyj @ January 28 2009, 2:52 PM GMTWell that makes Switzerland, Canada, Sweden, Finland, Australia, Poland and Germany odd. Most of whom have far lower rates of violent crimes than the UK.
Would the idea that a girl on a bus had a licensed can of pepper spray really make you crap yourself in terror? That perhaps inspired by an especially strident Germaine Greer article is going to give you a good spraying.
Or would the sheer oddness melt you're brain? Do you honestly think that other European cities streets are scarier than London or Manchester?
How about calming down some, you big silly bear.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ January 28 2009, 2:54 PM GMTHow about calming down some, you big silly bear.
I like him worked up. He's slowly morphing into Richard Littlejohn. 
Oh perfectly calm.
It's more a philosophical thing on my behalf. Violent impulses are perfectly natural and human. Along with empathy, compassion anger.
It's the only one we seem in this country to be utterly terrified and in denial of.
We're a violent species pretending we're not is anthropologically irresponsible.
Quote: chipolata @ January 28 2009, 2:36 PM GMTIt's asking a lot for a sleepwalker to get up, leave his own house, traverse a road or street, find DaButt's, and then break in.
As a teen I once walked across a road, made a call from a phone box, yelled at the person on the other end, let myself back in my house and went back to bed, all whilst asleep.
The only reason I know that for sure is that I was living with my folks at the time and it was my mum I shouted at. She said after getting the call that she checked my room but I wasn't there (despite me having gone to sleep in my bed as usual). Deducing that the nearest phone was the one opposite our house I went and checked it out. Inside I found the belt to my dressing gown and my phone calling card, minus a unit.
My point is, there's a gap between my making the call and returning home that's totally unaccounted for. Having done everything that I did, it's not outside the realms of possibility that I might have wandered into some places that I wasn't meant to be. I don't imagine I'd have broken glass without waking myself up but who knows for sure? If a door weren't locked I could easily have walked into the wrong house, and if I were unlucky enough to live near DaButt I'd be a corpse.
Quote: David Bussell @ January 28 2009, 2:58 PM GMTAs a teen I once walked across a road, made a phone call from a call box, yelled at the person on the other end, let myself back in my house and went back to bed, all whilst asleep.
The only reason I know that for sure is that I was living with my folks at the time and it was my mum I shouted at. She said after getting the call that she checked my room but I wasn't there (despite me having gone to sleep in my bed as usual). Deducing that the nearest phone was the one opposite our house I went and checked it out. Inside I found the belt to my dressing gown and my phone calling card, minus a unit.
My point is, there's a gap between my making the call and returning home that's totally unaccounted for. Having done everything that I did, it's not outside the realms of possibility that I might have wandered into some places that I wasn't meant to be. I don't imagine I'd have broken glass without waking myself up but who knows for sure? If a door weren't locked I could easily have walked into the wrong house, and if I were unlucky enough to live near DaButt I'd be a corpse.
My neighbor has an autistic adult son that sleep walks. I have found him on my porch trying to get in many times.
Bussell you may have given me the alibi I was looking for in my new career as a murderer/rapist/burglar.
Quote: sootyj @ January 28 2009, 2:57 PM GMTWe're a violent species pretending we're not is anthropologically irresponsible.
So you're saying we SHOULD be violent? There's nothing wrong with feeling, but I'd like to think that we could think violent things but not act on them. Being violent is irresponsible. Yes we're a violent species, but that doesn't mean we should just give in to that. I hope we never meet in a dark alley Sooty, I fear for my safety!