If you knew the mess 1000s of people would be in with out them.
Frankly including people you probably know.
Quote: Griff @ November 19 2008, 12:27 AM GMTWell, yes. That's kind of what I did say.
Can I call it an opinion, albeit a heartfelt one.
The ultimate taboo? Page 4
Quote: zooo @ November 19 2008, 12:04 AM GMTOf COURSE no one goes up to the mother of, oh wait, she killed him, the... other relatives of Baby P and makes a joke about it. Doesn't mean we can't make jokes to each other about it.
See? You got away with a joke about it.
I don't think any subjects should be taboo but you can handle a taboo subject without being needlessly insensitive. Some people make jokes just to shock, deliberately. That's usually not all that funny as it is just someone trying too hard to be controversial. But there are probably good jokes in pretty much any subject.
I haven't been on it much for the last couple of weeks but I'd be VERY surprised if there weren't some Baby P jokes on b3ta.com. As that's a visual medium, single pictures or extremely short animations, it tends to be an easier way of covering dodgy subjects in an offensive but still funny way.
e.g. if forced to do one on the subject, I would probably photoshop a picture of Ian Huntley on Blockbusters saying, "I'll have a Baby P please, Bob."
And before anyone gets too offended at that, it's your own fault, this discussion forced me to think about how it would be possible to joke on the subject.
Shock horror Afinkawan has come up with the first one, and not a bad one at that.
I remember the Ian Huntley joke:
What's pink and smells of holly? Ian Huntley's dick.
That's quite a shocker, you can see though they have similar structure,
A kind of taboo busting horriblness.
I take it no one's sending these to 118 118.
Satirise the situation; as in social workers, a particular council and the media coverage, but there's nothing remotely funny about the details or circumstance of a specific toddler's death. Unless of course you're of a similar mindset to the person who tortured and terrorised him - then you probably could find humour in it.
I'm not easily shocked, just really disappointed in mean jokes, like that one quoted earlier. Referring to specific children who have been killed is not in the slightest bit funny. Not shocking either, just sad and mean.
I've done jokes about a secific serious illness (that has affected my family) because a) the butt of the joke is myself and I feel being personally touched by it means I'm qualified to speak about it - however flippantly and b) because I find it personally therapeautic and hope others might. Laughing at things is a good way of reducing their power and menace.
I think anyone mature and who has had/have children of their own wouldn't find any jokes specifically about this child funny. The difference about general jokes about cancer, car crashes, suicide or whatever are because they're universal and touch us all - specifics are just hurtful. And that's when humour tips over into bullying.
Quote: sootyj @ November 18 2008, 11:22 PM GMTHaving read much material on the BabyP case I have been shocked and saddened.
But I find a nagging question, are elements of this case a fit topic for satire?
Please note I haven't written anything on this subject.
I think the actual death is to painful and monsterous for it ever to be a subject for humor?
But at the same time there are distinctive issues I feel should be adressed and perhaps satire maybe a way of doing this.
1 Social workers spend 70% of time on computers instead of face to face work.
2 Tabloids alternating between incompetent social workers abandon kids and evil social workers snatch kids.And other issues.
Again I haven't written so much of a line on this subject.
But I worry that not being able to joke on any part of this is akin to not discussing it, or atleast not as much as one could.
I'm genuinely interested in peoples thoughts on this subject.
I believe there is no taboos in comedy itself BUT it's down to the comic to decide where the line is drawn. The important thing is to remember the fact it is virtually impossible to write any joke without offending somebody so when you write a joke you should ask yourself if it's one you can honestly defend. If so, it's no hold barred. Don't bother if you cannot even defend it yourself.
I think most comics would agree though to make jokes so soon after the event would be tasteless.
Quote: Nigel Kelly @ November 19 2008, 10:35 AM GMTWhat's pink and smells of holly? Ian Huntley's dick.
Quote: Aaron @ November 19 2008, 12:58 PM GMT
Give it a few more years and you probably won't find that funny.
Quote: RubyMae - Glamourous Snowdrop at Large @ November 19 2008, 11:58 AM GMTI believe there is no taboos in comedy itself BUT it's down to the comic to decide where the line is drawn. The important thing is to remember the fact it is virtually impossible to write any joke without offending somebody so when you write a joke you should ask yourself if it's one you can honestly defend. If so, it's no hold barred. Don't bother if you cannot even defend it yourself.
I think most comics would agree though to make jokes so soon after the event would be tasteless.
I'd say that the time for joking should be at the time, not after.
Maybe after 9/11 if more people had tried to show just how silly the mania and paranoia was, it might have taken a little of the wind out of the sails of the war of error.
Right now there's investigations reports and all that on Harringay.
I'd hope some humor would fill the gaps where I suspect the two difering sides aren't talking.
Maybe it might help, only I fear the cure for this situation maybe worse than the disease.
I don't think a couple of jokes on this subject at a topical comedy show is going to solve the problem.
If I thought a sketch at NR/TS would change anything other than my bloated ego, then I'd be missing some sandwiches out of my picnic.
I'm thinking more generically, is it ok to joke about the horrific and can it help?
Russell Brand was sacked for appearing on MTV on 10/11/2003 dressed as Bin Laden.
Was he so wrong?
Quote: sootyj @ November 19 2008, 1:13 PM GMTI'm thinking more generically, is it ok to joke about the horrific and can it help?
Yes, it can help. But it depends on how it's done.
I think turning hate figures (Bin Laden, Hitler, Kilroy, etc) into figures of fun through jokes and mockery belittles them and reduces some of their power over us.
As does exploding ridiculos ideas and conceits.
I'm thinking of a sketch where Windsor Social Services take Charles into care.
Quote: sootyj @ November 19 2008, 1:21 PM GMTAs does exploding ridiculos ideas and conceits.
I'm thinking of a sketch where Windsor Social Services take Charles into care.
I can't see how that would be offensive.
I've done a little joke before about how some child-rearing practices used by the upper and middle-classes would be regarded as abuse if they happened in lower-class or poor families.
From my understanding Prince Charles was quite neglected by his mother as a child and emotionally abused by his father.