Quote: chipolata @ November 12 2008, 1:10 PM GMTWe need to sterilise vast swathes of the population.
Sadly taking their benefits away would have a similar effect.
You know for every failure like this 1000s of people with dificulties bring up their kids fine, with a bit of support and help.
We musn't focus only on the failures.
Quote: sootyj @ November 12 2008, 1:10 PM GMTThe depth of inadequacy that alot of people have.
I don't think breaking your kid's back and torturing them could, even in the loosest sense, be considered inadequacy.
Evil rather than inadequate.
Dan
Quote: sootyj @ November 12 2008, 1:11 PM GMTSadly taking their benefits away would have a similar effect.
You know for every failure like this 1000s of people with dificulties bring up their kids fine, with a bit of support and help.
We musn't focus only on the failures.
Yes, but 'difficulties' is a lot different to parents kicking the shit out of their baby Sooty. If you're poor you don't punch your baby. If you're crazy you punch your baby. Help those with 'difficulties', stop the baby punchers.
My friend works for social services and she REALLY wants to get out of it. She says no one cares about the children themselves where she works, it's all about ticking boxes and she has seen so many cases where there has been overreaction to nothing then no action taken where it's needed. She tries to speak out a lot but gets grief from her collegues and her boss over it. It's all very sad and I'd hate to be in that position. I'm not saying all social workers are this bad but something needs to be done. Mistakes just cannot afford to be made ever.
Quote: swerytd @ November 12 2008, 1:13 PM GMTI don't think breaking your kid's back and torturing them could, even in the loosest sense, be considered inadequacy.
Exactly. There is a big-BIG difference.
Quote: chipolata @ November 12 2008, 1:08 PM GMTI wouldn't be a social worker for all the tea in China. The dregs they have to deal with on a daily basis is staggering: ie., the underclass. Worthless, feckless wastes of space who shouldn't be allowed to breathe, let alone have children.
Quote: Matthew Stott @ November 12 2008, 1:14 PM GMTYes, but 'difficulties' is a lot different to parents kicking the shit out of their baby Sooty. If you're poor you don't punch your baby. If you're crazy you punch your baby. Help those with 'difficulties', stop the baby punchers.
I think what he means is those parents do not use their own upbringing and circumstances as an excuse to inflict cruelty and neglect. Some do sadly and there is NEVER an excuse to inflict harm on a child.
Quote: RubyMae - Glamourous Snowdrop at Large @ November 12 2008, 1:16 PM GMTI think what he means is those parents do not use their own upbringing and circumstances as an excuse to inflict cruelty and neglect. Some do sadly and there is NEVER an excuse to inflict harm on a child.
Some of them are little f**kers though.
Quote: RubyMae - Glamourous Snowdrop at Large @ November 12 2008, 1:14 PM GMTMy friend works for social services and she REALLY wants to get out of it. She says no one cares about the children themselves where she works, it's all about ticking boxes and she has seen so many cases where there has been overreaction to nothing then no action taken where it's needed. She tries to speak out a lot but gets grief from her collegues and her boss over it. It's all very sad and I'd hate to be in that position. I'm not saying all social workers are this bad but something needs to be done. Mistakes just cannot afford to be made ever.
The saddest thing about this story Ruby, is that I am not surprised in the slightest.
Social services like the police and schools are a victim of a dictatorial box ticking central run government country.
The chilling thing is alot of these abusers are actually quite sane.
And you'd be surprised what can slip past the most attentive and skilled social worker.
The fear of being complained about can be paralysing in almost all government professions.
Incompetence is tolerated, perceived prejudice isn't.
Missing targets is unforgivable.
Question is are we prepared to live with a more unaccountable more invasive social welfare system?
It upsets me when people use their upbringing and circumstances as any excuse to commit any crime. Abuse, violence, drugs, gang warfare, etc, saying "What else can I do? It's easy for those with money or a good education, I had such a hard time growing up". I'm sure you did and I feel bad for you I do but don't you dare use that as a reason for stealing from or harming another human being. I personally grew up with very little and didn't have the best education. I've never robbed anyone because of it, I've never commited fraud because of it, I've never taken drugs, I've never physically abused someone, and so have millions of people from the most terrible backgrounds who have gone on to do amazing things. There are ways out if you just stop blaming everyone else in the world and lashing out at them and make the effort to not go down that road. Get help with your problems, get work, take free courses, just do it!
Speech over.
Quote: Gavin @ November 12 2008, 1:21 PM GMTSome of them are little f**kers though.
Teenagers are a different story. 
Quote: RubyMae - Glamourous Snowdrop at Large @ November 12 2008, 1:26 PM GMTIt upsets me when people use their upbringing and circumstances as any excuse to commit any crime. Abuse, violence, drugs, gang warfare, etc, saying "What else can I do? It's easy for those with money or a good education, I had such a hard time growing up".
Not just crime, but pretty much anything. People should take responsibility for themselves. They should better themselves, and not just settle for what they grew up with.
Nothing scares a social worker more than an articulate middle class family.
An articulate middle class family with the money for a solicitor is like Godzilla.
This maybe why they seem to be involved with them so rarely.
And Ruby you are completely right.
Quote: Aaron @ November 12 2008, 1:30 PM GMTNot just crime, but pretty much anything. People should take responsibility for themselves. They should better themselves, and not just settle for what they grew up with.
But a kinder fairer society should still be their offer a hand and support, or what's society for?
It should be about helping people to help them selves.
Quote: chipolata @ November 12 2008, 1:10 PM GMTWe need to sterilise vast swathes of the population.
We need decent Sex Education in this country. It's disgusting how little teenagers know. I used to do volunteer work helping promote awareness and one girl really frightened me when she told me she thought she was pregnant from sitting on a toilet seat. The girl was 15. I've heard it all to be honest. I was lucky enough to go to a primary school that had a great programme (Which had to be started a year early when a certain member of the class came back from the school holidays with new sweater bunnies aged only 9 
) which was lucky for me cause at my secondary school our sex ed consisted of labeling a diagram of what looked like a goats head then getting a visit during PE from a rep from tampax for the girls and durex for the boys. Brillopads 
.
Quote: swerytd @ November 12 2008, 12:56 PM GMTGonna go all serious for a moment in this thread. Normally I'm quite tolerant in a way that means I don't have to sound off about everything that happens in the world and keep schtum about stuff.
But this makes me sick to the stomach and nearly to the point of tears when I even consider what was going on.
It was a f**king kid, for god's sake! A little baby. Who can it f**king trust if it can't trust it's f**king parents???
I genuinely hope you get violently raped 9 or 10 times a day in prison, you f**king scum. To within an inch of your f**king life, but not quite enough to kill you. Just so you have to endure the same thing again and again and a-f**king-gain every f**king day of your sentence until the day before you are released, when you are slowly lowered into a vat of acid.
You don't even deserve the relief of death, you c**ts.
Totally agree with you Dan. The f**king scum makes my blood boil. They deserve to rot in hell.