Believable Comedy Page 3

Didn't Victor Meldrew have something to say on this very subject??

For me the problem with your premise for a sitcom Bushbaby isn't so much the first story as you describe it. WHether it would be believable or not would be in the execution, I haven't read your script so I wouldn't have a clue.But for me the party planning premise is kind of unbelievable for a series, every week they organise a party with disastrous and hilarious consequences. You seem to be describing that as the engine of your show and I don't think you need to. The situation is them all sharing a squat or a house or whatever. Root the premise in some kind of perceived reality and each episode would be about the characters and not the 'sit' per se.

Yes, I uderstand what you're saying marc but imagination is imagination. I can take constructive critcism...i.e. the characters are two dimensional or 'we' didn't find it funny but not it's an unbelievable storyline and the characters are not believable.

The idea was to do six eps, each week a different party theme. One was a cowboy party whereby a horse came in and crapped. guess what? Peter Kay had that in Pheonix Nights!

There was a pilot broadcast last year with a fairly similar premise - Bash, I believe it was called - so it's not exactly an unworkable idea.

Quote: bushbaby @ April 17 2008, 11:10 AM BST

Yes, I uderstand what you're saying marc but imagination is imagination. I can take constructive critcism...i.e. the characters are two dimensional or 'we' didn't find it funny but not it's an unbelievable storyline and the characters are not believable.

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I'm not sure that the latter two aren't constructive (certainly, they're more constructive and useful than 'we' didn't find it funny)

I'm just saying don;t throw the baby out withthe bathwater. It's the 'legs' issue really. You may be able to pull of six brilliant scripts written around the misfits organising a party, I reckon it would be very hard - but could you pull of three or four series of it or more. What people are looking for is shows that can run and run, and be fresh and lively each episode. So the original engine has to be able to drive that kind of distance. If it is character and relationship based you don't have a problem. If it is party organising based - I think you do. So keep the baby is what I am saying just give it another name.

I didn't see bash, Antrax, that's interesting.
The 'party' one of mine was written about eight years back and I first entered it in a Ch4 comp.

Quote: Marc P @ April 17 2008, 11:16 AM BST

I'm just saying don;t throw the baby out withthe bathwater. It's the 'legs' issue really. You may be able to pull of six brilliant scripts written around the misfits organising a party, I reckon it would be very hard - but could you pull of three or four series of it or more. What people are looking for is shows that can run and run, and be fresh and lively each episode. So the original engine has to be able to drive that kind of distance. If it is character and relationship based you don't have a problem. If it is party organising based - I think you do. So keep the baby is what I am saying just give it another name.

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Yes, maybe you're right, they could still organise parties but we don't actually see the parties it's their relationships with each other as they are organising them.
At the end of the first ep, they have put an ad in the paper, they're starting out on their own as party organisers. But it could be more set in their lounge and the conflict etc around the organising

Quote: bushbaby @ April 17 2008, 11:18 AM BST

I didn't see bash, Antrax, that's interesting.
The 'party' one of mine was written about eight years back and I first entered it in a Ch4 comp.

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Oh, I didn't mean to suggest that you'd nicked it, don't worry.

I've had a brief look - I can sort of see some of the point. You've explained here why it could make sense and given the justification of the guy being fancied etc. which is all well and good, but it isn't there on the page in that first scene, leaving it looking less plausible than it is. It might become clear later on, but with people only reading ten pages that's not much help.

What I would suggest is adding a few lines to acknowledge that it initially appears implausible. Maybe even a character questioning why anyone would give him the money, maybe suggesting the crush or at least setting it up as a mystery to hook the audience.

edited to add: that leads me to a further thought, actually. The problem isn't that the concept is unbelievable, or the characters unbelievable - but the way they react to the situation is. A guy announces that his mate has offered him ten grand to organise a party, something he has no experience of, and nobody bats an eye, they just all go 'yeah, let's do this'.

Bushbaby, I've just had a very quick look at that link. For me, it's got a couple of standout lines - and there is a definite energy there between the characters. I would tend to agree with the criticism of the situation...for me, it's a bit fussy. Have you thought about writing these characters just going about their lives in and around the house share? Maybe there could be an episode about party planning, but an entire series based on it deosnt strike me as a go-er.

Yes, that's a good idea Antrax. The 'gay' bit is made clear later on and it is obvious why the rich man has handed over the money, only to be rejected again by the gay designer.

Thanks Manchester.
The thing about comedy as we all know is that it's subjective. I visualise these five characters and their reactions/acting it out etc. It's sometimes totally different off the page and I can so visualise the two black characters, particulary, but I also like Jon, he's camp. They do take the piss out of each other

I wanted to ask as well, when one is told characters are two dimensional, what about Two Pints Of Lager? The dialogue in that is smart arse one line dialogue, nothing is in depth, we don't know their dreams/aspirations/backgrounds, it is purely quick 'gag' lines all the way through.
I like the sitcom BTW but I would say the characters are two dimensional.

Quote: bushbaby @ April 17 2008, 11:48 AM BST

I wanted to ask as well, when one is told characters are two dimensional, what about Two Pints Of Lager? The dialogue in that is smart arse one line dialogue, nothing is in depth, we don't know their dreams/aspirations/backgrounds, it is purely quick 'gag' lines all the way through.
I like the sitcom BTW but I would say the characters are two dimensional.

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You know, I think the characters in Two Pints are relatively 3 dimensional. They're shallow, sure, but they're not just quip machines, to my eyes anyway.

If you look at the scripts though Antrax on writersroom, each character basically only says one line at a time, no room for depth but yet if one sent out a script like that, it'd be.....there's no depth to the characters. I'm getting totally confused with the idea of writing.
As it's one of my favourite sitcoms, could it be again that on the page is not always as funny as when acted out and it's the actors that do a good job

You can make mileage out of the most limited of premises, witness the success of The Smoking Room and Marion and Geoff. If you're a good enough writer, you can make anything work.

Quote: bushbaby @ April 17 2008, 12:42 PM BST

If you look at the scripts though Antrax on writersroom, each character basically only says one line at a time, no room for depth but yet if one sent out a script like that, it'd be.....there's no depth to the characters. I'm getting totally confused with the idea of writing.
As it's one of my favourite sitcoms, could it be again that on the page is not always as funny as when acted out and it's the actors that do a good job

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Oh, I've looked at the script on WR. Just I think the characters are 3-dimensionally shallow. And to be fair, I think that it's also not the pilot script - this is a script at the point where everyone knows the characters. Most of the gags aren't, imo, 'jokes', they're gags derived from character. The depth is in the jokes.

Hi Bushbaby

I just had a look at the scene you posted a link to. Do you think the critism may because the characters are stereotypical?

Quote: chipolata @ April 17 2008, 12:52 PM BST

You can make mileage out of the most limited of premises, witness the success of The Smoking Room and Marion and Geoff. If you're a good enough writer, you can make anything work.

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Good writing is in the design.