I read the news today oh boy! Page 2,611

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 7:56 AM

I've amended the Hitchcock one, am no I'm not, I've read loads on the great man, he was well known to be of the right but made a point of never discussing his politics as thought that was vulgar.

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Fine. Let's see some evidence to support what you're saying then.
Supporting the war effort does not mean he was right-wing in itself.

Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 7th July 2023, 7:46 AM

It is rife with activists who are lazy and more concerned about 'rights' than caring for the sick.

T.

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This has never been my experience.
What experiences have you had with this? Or are you just repeating right-wing newspaper stuff?

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 7:56 AM

I've amended the Hitchcock one, and no I'm not, I've read loads on the great man, he was well known to be of the right but made a point of never discussing his politics as thought that was vulgar.

Deliverance is a promotion of American rights of self defence and fighting back, Zulu is saluting a noble British military stand in the days of the empire, and TLGF is about pro British cockney yuppie gangsters.

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Zulu:
"The principal artists responsible for Zulu were hardly Establishment figures. Screenwriter John Prebble was a former Communist Party member who had volunteered to fight in the Spanish Civil War. His co-writer, the American director Cy Endfield, had fled Hollywood in the early 1950s after he was named as a Communist during the McCarthyite witch-hunts. Endfield's production partner and the film's main star was Stanley Baker, a life-long supporter of the Labour Party. All three were committed to progressive causes, but their motives in making Zulu were not political. It is not an anti-imperial diatribe any more than it is a celebration of colonial conquest."

But again you are detailing the words of those who made it, ignoring what the film is and how it is perceived. It is largely seen as a stirring salute to the valour of the British units at Yorkes'e Drift.

Yes and Stanley Baker was also a proud Welshman who wanted to honour the Welsh Guards for their heroism in that battle, and the film was his idea.

Quote: chipolata @ 7th July 2023, 6:33 AM

Virtually every decent film and TV show is written by, directed by, or stars lefties. So if you hate lefties you shouldn't be watching any films or TV shows. And you probably shouldn't read books or listen to music, since they're mainly lefties too.

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We were discussing the intentions of the people who made the films though? See above! Not how some of the audience may have chosen to interpret them.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 6:46 AM

Fawlty Towers? u?

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Have you not watched Fawlty Towers? It might as well be called Wokey Towers since the person made to look the biggest fool is the heterosexual white male, whereby the most intelligent and sympathetic character is a young woman. If it were made now GB News would devote hours to raging about how it's a woke hatchet job on white English people.

Man I didn't think any politician could be as bad as Trump, but this Desantis geezer pushes him close

What a prize dipshit

Quote: Chris Hallam @ 7th July 2023, 9:04 AM

Not how some of the audience may have chosen to interpret them.

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We can tell you're a journo from this line alone Chris. Those films I mentioned are widely acknowledged by every film guide going as being roughly what I said. There is a tinge at the end of Zulu of it being what became a fashionable trend in movie making, an anti war film, but it is overwhelmingly as Baker intended a tribute to The Welsh Guards and British Army at that battle.

It's acquired an unfashionable right wing reputation with all the modern demonising of British colonialism and as a sad result, I've not seen it on TV for a good few years, whereas it used to be shown alot. I have a particular fondness for it being the first film I saw at the cinema, aged 4. (No it wasn't as a new release!)

I do a great Michael Caine

"...Zulus....fowzands of 'em.."

Ayythangyoww

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 9:12 PM

I've not seen it on TV for a good few years, whereas it used to be shown alot. I have a particular fondness for it being the first film I saw at the cinema, aged 4. (No it wasn't as a new release!)

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Zulu is on Film4 11am this Sunday and again 4.10 pm Thursday (and of course on +1 an hour later).

Quote: chipolata @ 7th July 2023, 10:24 AM

Have you not watched Fawlty Towers? It might as well be called Wokey Towers since the person made to look the biggest fool is the heterosexual white male, whereby the most intelligent and sympathetic character is a young woman. If it were made now GB News would devote hours to raging about how it's a woke hatchet job on white English people.

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Well no it wouldn't, as it's the same with the portrayal of most objectional characters in comedy, the majority of viewers actually love them for their uncivil behaviour and blatant conceitedness. As do the creators, Cleese thought his model, Sinclair was 'wonderful' Speight liked Garnett and Chappell liked Rigsby. It's an old liberal lie to say they are created to denounce that type of character, they have to say that or they wouldn't be allowed to make a good living from them in the first place. The arts are full of disingenuous diplomatic quotes from artists just to get their work aired and accepted. How successful was Hitler the painter?

Oh thanks I'll watch that then as my DVD is in storage.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 9:12 PM

We can tell you're a journo from this line alone Chris. Those films I mentioned are widely acknowledged by every film guide going as being roughly what I said.

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Which film guides say this? Feel free to quote anything you like.
I'm not convinced Basil Fawlty, Rigsby and Alf Garnett were all created because the writers secretly wanted to promote their characters' views.
I don't think you really think this either.

You're right I don't think that because that's not what I said. But the creators do have a sneaky regard for them, it's been recorded. I'm not going to play the game of having to cut and paste research just to please someone's demands, I've read it or consumed those things in some way and I wouldn't say it if I wasn't sure of it. And how can they not do so when their creations have made a very good living for them. In TV as with most arts one big success will open the door to more of your projects.

They are funny characters, we love to laugh at them, consequently many viewers come to love Basil Fawlty the fictional character who does what a lot of us aren't allowed to do but very occasionally wish we could. Everyone knows they are wrong and terrible examples to follow in real life. But sitcom isn't real life it's a release from it, a fantasy.

The only reason I've joined in this discussion with my unfashionable views is because I know the general premise that all artists are lefties is as loaded and debatable as they come. I've been to drama school, I know all about the liberal left leaning slant everyone is supposed to conform to, and it is essentially an Orwellian construct designed to fool commissioners that every piece of artistic work is humanistic and life affirming and non threatening to minorities and in modern parlance PC. The fact that many creators and or performers can be deeply opinionated, selfish, difficult, and sometimes obnoxious in real life rather puts a lie to this charade imo. I've met a few and read about a lot more who resent having to parade themselves as a whole world loving lefty luvvy just to get work in an industry run by matronly phonies.

Quote: lofthouse @ 7th July 2023, 8:53 PM

Man I didn't think any politician could be as bad as Trump, but this Desantis geezer pushes him close

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He's young, smart, and popular, and he'd make a better president than Trump or Biden by several orders of magnitude.

Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 7th July 2023, 10:20 PM

You're right I don't think that because that's not what I said. But the creators do have a sneaky regard for them, it's been recorded. I'm not going to play the game of having to cut and paste research just to please someone's demands, I've read it or consumed those things in some way and I wouldn't say it if I wasn't sure of it. And how can they not do so when their creations have made a very good living for them. In TV as with most arts one big success will open the door to more of your projects.

They are funny characters, we love to laugh at them, consequently many viewers come to love Basil Fawlty the fictional character who does what a lot of us aren't allowed to do but very occasionally wish we could. Everyone knows they are wrong and terrible examples to follow in real life. But sitcom isn't real life it's a release from it, a fantasy.

The only reason I've joined in this discussion with my unfashionable views is because I know the general premise that all artists are lefties is as loaded and debatable as they come. I've been to drama school, I know all about the liberal left leaning slant everyone is supposed to conform to, and it is essentially an Orwellian construct designed to fool commissioners that every piece of artistic work is humanistic and life affirming and non threatening to minorities and in modern parlance PC. The fact that many creators and or performers can be deeply opinionated, selfish, difficult, and sometimes obnoxious in real life rather puts a lie to this charade imo. I've met a few and read about a lot more who resent having to parade themselves as a whole world loving lefty luvvy just to get work in an industry run by matronly phonies.

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Walt Disney. D.W Griffith. Evelyn Waugh. Bruce Willis. James Stewart. Jeffery Archer. Jim Davidson.
There are plenty of examples of right-wing creatives out there. The only genuine ones you've suggested so far have been Clint Eastwood and the Dirty Harry films.

I'm aware of all of them and hundreds more but put the ones that most appeal to my taste in viewing otherwise I'd still be typing them. Don't you think this rather rubbishes the claim you agree with that

Quote: chipolata @ 7th July 2023, 6:33 AM

Virtually every decent film and TV show is written by, directed by, or stars lefties.

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Quote: chipolata @ 7th July 2023, 6:33 AM

Virtually every decent film and TV show is written by, directed by, or stars lefties. So if you hate lefties you shouldn't be watching any films or TV shows. And you probably shouldn't read books or listen to music, since they're mainly lefties too.

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