What kind of lawless hellhole is America that everybody has to carry a gun to protect themselves from all the heavily armed criminals and loons? It sounds like the worst place in the world to live.
I read the news today oh boy! Page 2,401
Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 18th May 2022, 7:55 PMSo massacres are just an acceptable bi-product of gun ownership.
We'll just ignore the massive number killed by them every year cos I like guns.
That appears to be your logic.
1. Massacres are rare.
2. It's nearly impossible to prevent a determined killer from using guns, knives, explosives, poison, or vehicles to kill innocent people.
3. Criminals will not voluntarily turn in their guns in any buy-back or confiscation program, ensuring that they'll remained armed even if the populace is disarmed.
4. I'll consider giving up my (non-hunting) guns when I'm provided 24/7 armed protection like the politicians who enact gun laws enjoy.
Quote: chipolata @ 18th May 2022, 8:06 PMWhat kind of lawless hellhole is America that everybody has to carry a gun to protect themselves from all the heavily armed criminals and loons? It sounds like the worst place in the world to live.
It's not, I've explained as much, and millions of people are willing to travel through deadly swamps, treacherous seas, and scorching deserts in order to try to emigrate here from actual lawless hellholes.
I don't think anyone's necessarily right or wrong here - it's just different cultures.
Anyway, isn't it nice to see Stephen Goodlad and Lazzard on the same side for once! Tell me I'm wrong!
Quote: a plate @ 18th May 2022, 9:35 PMAnyway, isn't it nice to see Stephen Goodlad and Lazzard on the same side for once! Tell me I'm wrong!
I have a knack for bringing people together. Anyone have contact info for Putin and Zelenskyy?
Quote: DaButt @ 18th May 2022, 8:37 PM....millions of people are willing to travel through deadly swamps, treacherous seas, and scorching deserts in order to try to emigrate here
So when Trump "drained the swamp" he actually made it easier to emigrate from Mexico, dope.
As I thought, massacres don't count. (I like guns attitude)
Not many carry poison, explosives or knives despite what you read.
It's about guns - just guns. A device that allows you to kill someone from a distance without any harm to yourself and the person you have aimed at is dead.
I've seen the Buffalo shooting video, more by accident really as it was just a kid talking while driving wearing a go-pro camera on his head.
I was in shock and wish I hadn't. But it's only rare eh, so no need to do anything.
Quote: Firkin @ 18th May 2022, 9:50 PMSo when Trump "drained the swamp" he actually made it easier to emigrate from Mexico, dope.
It would be nice if someone could drain the swamp in the Darien Gap. Untold numbers of immigrants are raped, robbed, and murdered in that stretch of Panamanian jungle. It's a human tragedy.
Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 18th May 2022, 9:57 PMAs I thought, massacres don't count. (I like guns attitude)
I didn't say that.
Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 18th May 2022, 9:57 PMNot many carry poison, explosives or knives despite what you read.
More people are killed by knives, hands and feet than are killed by rifles of all kinds - including so called "assault rifles."
Quote: Stephen Goodlad @ 18th May 2022, 9:57 PMBut it's only rare eh, so no need to do anything.
Yes, deaths in mass shootings (however you define them) are relatively rare. The vast majority of gun deaths are suicides (about 20,000); drug overdose deaths outnumber them by more than 5 to 1. Gun murders are typically in the 10,000 range; drug overdose deaths outnumber them by 10 to one. Mass shooting deaths are typically in the 500-700 range (most are gang shootings and street crime, not rampages); drug overdose deaths outnumber them by 150 to 1. But for some reason, it's always the legal, law-abiding gun owners who are expected to pay the price by giving up their constitutional right to self-defense.
The death penalty is already on hand in most states to act as a deterrent to murder. What makes anyone think that additional legislation would cause criminals to stand up and take notice? Imagine the carnage if an American administration sent armed officers to forcibly remove Americans' guns. It would likely be catastrophic and possibly Civil War-like in nature.
Quote: a plate @ 18th May 2022, 9:35 PMI don't think anyone's necessarily right or wrong here - it's just different cultures.
Anyway, isn't it nice to see Stephen Goodlad and Lazzard on the same side for once! Tell me I'm wrong!
Absolutely.
We may disagree with each other on pretty well everything, but at least we'll never shoot each other.
Don't be so sure.
Muskets at dawn.
Quote: DaButt @ 17th May 2022, 3:54 PMIf he bought it legally, he went through an FBI background check.
The right to own/carry a firearm to protect oneself against the millions of guns in the hands of criminals is an important one.
I'm hesitant to believe anything published on anti-gun websites as they often play fast and loose with facts and figures, but according to their statistics there are more than twice as many instances of defensive use of a firearm than there are mass shootings (itself a very loosely defined term).
Defensive use of a firearm occurs thousands of times every day, although they seldom make the news unless someone is actually shot. Here are two such cases from the last two weeks here in my city:
https://news4sanantonio.com/news/local/homeowner-shoots-kills-intruder-caught-breaking-into-her-home
https://news4sanantonio.com/news/local/homeowner-shoots-man-accused-of-breaking-into-her-house
I won't argue against having a gun at home for protection in America, but I question how useful they really are for protection in public spaces. To me it seems they provide a sense of security for the concealed carrier much more than an actual protection of their life. In other words a very false sense of security. If a maniac with an assault gun were to target them in a shooting spree, they'd simply die with the handgun in their jacket, and I wonder how many licensed gun carriers have died that way. Are there (independent body) stats on this? I wonder how many had their own gun at that concert in Nevada, they would've provided zero protection of their lives and others.
One reason I think this is because you never (seem to) hear of a licensed concealed gun carrier actually shooting the killer and preventing further bloodshed in these going postal murder sprees. And I find this odd, given there are reportedly so many fully legal concealed gun carriers in the States. Surely one of them would have the balls to stop a maniac in his tracks before the police finally arrive, always too late. The fact it never seems to happen tells me how ineffective they actually are as a defensive weapon in the heat of the moment.
I think Americas love of the gun borders on a fetish and is something we'll never understand. And the notion that you need more guns to stop gun wielding criminals is ludicrous since most of these rampage killers seem to kill an awful lot of innocent bystanders before they themselves get shot.
Like many countries, the USA is divided.
About half the country would like stricter gun laws.
Unfortunately the half that don't, are armed.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 19th May 2022, 10:56 AMI wonder how many had their own gun at that concert in Nevada, they would've provided zero protection of their lives and others.
Firearms weren't allowed at that event anyway, so it's a moot point. Large gatherings (concerts, sporting events, etc.) typically feature metal detectors and bag searches. It's worth noting that in the Nevada shooting - the worst in the nation's history - the attacker fired more than a thousand rounds and killed 61 people and injured 411. The attack in Nice killed 87 and wounded more than 450 and the weapon was a vehicle.
Quote: Alfred J Kipper @ 19th May 2022, 10:56 AMI wonder how many had their own gun at that concert in Nevada, they would've provided zero protection of their lives and others.
One reason I think this is because you never (seem to) hear of a licensed concealed gun carrier actually shooting the killer and preventing further bloodshed in these going postal murder sprees. And I find this odd, given there are reportedly so many fully legal concealed gun carriers in the States. Surely one of them would have the balls to stop a maniac in his tracks before the police finally arrive, always too late. The fact it never seems to happen tells me how ineffective they actually are as a defensive weapon in the heat of the moment.
It happens all the time, but many news outlets are hesitant to report it. Here's one that I remember from my city:
Quote: Lazzard @ 19th May 2022, 11:51 AMLike many countries, the USA is divided.
About half the country would like stricter gun laws.
The latest Gallop poll shows that 36% of Americans want stricter gun control. It's important to note that "stricter gun control" encompasses things like "let's keep crazy people from buying guns" and "we should throw more people in jail for gun crimes". It does not indicate support for banning guns in general. That percentage would likely be in the single digits.
I notice that the number of children & parents killed by accident, by children playing with a loaded gun has been missed out above.
492 people unintentionally die by gun in an average year.
https://www.google.com/search?q=USA+children+killed+by+loaded+gun