I'm pretty sure that teachers are in it for their noble altruism - just like all MP's........
Things that piss you off Page 1,401
You must have had a bad time at school, paulted!
Quote: Hercules Grytpype Thynne @ 13th March 2014, 9:31 PM GMTAmen to that - I work in a high school (technician - not teacher!) and have never seen so much mismanagement and wasted money, and there are only about 10% who I would call genuine teachers - the rest are just there for the ride, pension and cushy life.
Of course as a technician you're fully qualified to make this judgement. So when were you seconded onto OFSTED to bring your judgement to the masses? I think the phrase we have to focus on is 'technician-not a teacher'.
Wow! teachers are so touchy!
Quote: paulted @ 13th March 2014, 9:27 PM GMTHey I love my job! I just proved my point that nobody forces teachers to do their jobs. So why do they keep moaning and threatening strikes every few months? They choose to do it. Don't like it? Do something else. Bottom line is they wouldn't last a minute in the real world.
What you call moaning we see as standing up for our rights. You work in a job with long hours and no union. I call that being a doormat. You want to let the bosses make you work piss poor hours, not see the kids and fail to have the basic right of being in a union, you carry on. When the shit hits the fan who will back you? No bugger that's what. You're welcome to it.
And education is as much in the real world as civil servants, police and nurses. Do you think we live in some parallel universe?
Just as with a lot of contentious arguments, both Paulted and everyone is correct to some degree -
Do teachers get paid enough? - They're not on a bad wage and if you get to be a headmaster or run a school, the wages make P Diddy blush. They get literally months off and can go home before 4pm and if it snows - kaching! Plus school trips, subsidised canteen, a guaranteed pension and a whole raft of benefits and perks that no one in the private sector could even dream about.
On the downside, they have to continually defend themselves from knife wielding violent chavs and even if they do survive, the chav parents come in to finish the job. Most people treat schools and teachers as extended childcare, teachers have to be beyond superhuman and act as parent, tutor, role model, psychologist, nurse and policeman, but they only get the one wage. The demands and expectations put upon them are incredible, if most people f**k up at their job, the worst thing that happens is some horsemeat ends up in a lasagne, but if a teacher screws up, it impacts society as a whole.
Why do they go on strike? - Because they can, they're all a bunch of lefty throwbacks from the 1970s who exist in a bubble. They pursue academia for academia's sake and very few can even remember what it's like to work in the private sector. They have a very vocal union who use threats against children to get what they want. People have a natural sympathy for teachers, so they exploit this to garner support, much like the emotionally blackmailing charity sector.
However, they're also not allowed to do their jobs properly. Every few months, an education minister has a 'thought' and the syllabus changes, exams change, teaching methods change, expectations are raised to unrealistic levels, league tables are drawn up and a whole slew of bureaucratic bullshit that has nothing to do with teaching kids how to read or write is shat down from on high and makes the teacher's job undoable.
So in short, they have it tough, but are paid well and can get key worker homes and pensions. Compare their lives to that of an Army sergeant or a Postman and they're positively millionaires.
Quote: paulted @ 13th March 2014, 10:18 PM GMTWow! teachers are so touchy!
So if I accused electricians of being a bunch of mostly unqualified over-paid rip-off merchants. That ok? But I don't know that they are. Why? Because I'm not an electrician that's why. You're talking about something you actually know nothing about. I'm not saying all teachers/schools are great but I bet there's some shitty electricians out there as well.
The sparks fly!
Its called being paid for the hours that you actually work. An equitable deal for employer and employee. Expecting bonuses and other sweeteners smacks of having your cake and eating it. I have worked at schools and seen some very diva-ish behaviour by staff. I hope you don't speak to the kids with that level of vulgarity! Standards are certainly dropping! Three curses in one paragraph....2/10. SEE ME LATER!
Teachers and electricians as equally valuable to our society. A fat cat banker would be tickled pink to see you two arguing as to who's more privileged!
Quote: paulted @ 13th March 2014, 10:40 PM GMTIts called being paid for the hours that you actually work. An equitable deal for employer and employee. Expecting bonuses and other sweeteners smacks of having your cake and eating it. I have worked at schools and seen some very diva-ish behaviour by staff. I hope you don't speak to the kids with that level of vulgarity! Standards are certainly dropping! Three curses in one paragraph....2/10. SEE ME LATER!
In case you hadn't noticed I'm not in school and you're an idiot of that much I'm sure. You offer opinions about things you have no idea. And that is my definition of an idiot.
My girlfriend is a teacher. She works up until 9pm most nights marking and doing planning. I think she's mental but I wouldn't dare say she had an easy ride and didn't deserve a good wage. Her class is under 10 pupils as well (it's a new/special school) so I can't even fathom how a class of 30+ would overwork a person.
That bloody Wonga advert where the old bloke is playing the acoustic guitar.
What exactly is it trying to say or prove?
I think some of the stigma against teachers is due to...
(1) It is seen as a job that anyone could do to some level. For example, most moderately-intelligent people might feel that they could probably produce a passable lesson in most non-STEM subjects, with a bit of preparation time. Whereas, many of these same random people could not perform many tasks carried out by nurses, electricians (etc.) in any way whatsoever.
The latter two careers have an element of "hidden knowledge" - which most non-industry people do not possess - and this adds to the credibility of their profession.
(2) With the exception of countries like Finland - where I've heard the occupation attracts the upper-level graduates for high salaries - teaching always seems like a backup option, or even a last-resort, for young graduates.
(3) The rise of 'unqualified' teachers over the past few decades - especially in TEFL - has further stained the reputation of the teaching profession.
Quote: roscoff @ 13th March 2014, 10:13 PM GMTOf course as a technician you're fully qualified to make this judgement. So when were you seconded onto OFSTED to bring your judgement to the masses? I think the phrase we have to focus on is 'technician-not a teacher'.
I think 20 years of watching what is going on qualifies me enough - OFSTED is just a farce anyway as "they" know when they are coming and clean up their act.
So what qualifies you to judge whether I know what I am talking about?